Ahh...controversy. Intellectual conversations are rife with it, families are torn asunder by it, school boards thrive on trying to eliminate it. You should probably know that I am not someone who shies away from controversy or controversial topics. Quite the opposite, in fact. I believe that controversy and the topics that define it have much to teach us, and I am confident that the subject of this blog will only serve to reinforce that belief. Remember the golden rule of 204--to disagree is not to disrespect.
Additionally, this topic falls in line with a paper you may be writing, so perhaps this week's blog question will give those of you who choose to write your description paper about this particular topic some unique insight or even a jumping-off point to the paper.
In 1999, a Gallup poll indicated that only approximately 60% of Americans believe that there is a hell. Out of that 60% only 4% were convinced that was their destination. So, first question--do YOU believe that hell exists? If so, do you know what it looks like? Smells like? Feels like? Where did your belief come from? Your parents? Your church? Your friends? What do you have to do in order to get there?
The word that is used most frequently in the New Testament for hell is Gehenna. Gehenna is a reference to the Valley of Hinnom located on the south side of Jerusalem, which served as the city's "garbage dump" during Jesus' time. The fires that burned here never went out. The Old Testament makes a reference to sheol as being a place where spirits reside (Deut. 32:22) and some of them will be resurrected to "everlasting life," while others are bound for "everlasting contempt" (Dan. 12:2) One is a worldly destination, the other spiritual. Which one sounds more realistic to you?
Dante Alighieri was a prolific writer who wrote the epic narrative poem titled Inferno in which the main character, Alighieri himself, travels through nine circles of hell. The main theme of this particular work is that there is a perfection to God's justice. Sinners on earth are relegated to various circles (or levels) of hell depending on the severity of sin. This would seem to indicate, at least in Alighieri's eyes, that there are varying degrees of sin and that each one is punishable in its own way. Do you believe this? If so, what is the worst sin that you can imagine and how should it be dealt with in hell?
Lastly, is it easily reconcilable to think of God as being the embodiment of love and grace yet imagine that it is through his word that people descend into hell, which is, ostensibly, a place of eternal suffering? (50 pts/400 words)
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
175 comments:
hey look at this Jam Jam's got the first post. All thanks to the sickness too.
jordan! why are you up so early...and where are you today I missed you in Cervi's class!?
-Carlisle
i'm really sick. Like throwing up all over the place. I think its the flu. Sorry I can't be in school today to brighten up everyones day.
oh and i was doing the bio lab last night with nanfara and bennett thats why I was up so late.
Feel better Jordy. See you soon. :)
wow.i did not expect a topic like this one to ever pop up, but i think this will be the most interesting topic yet..
Strange as it may sound, I have actually spent a good amount of time imagining what hell is like. Yes, I believe that hell exists. Hitler's got to go somewhere, right? I believe that hell is personalized, tailor fitted to each individual. Since I don't know other people's lives, I don't know what their hell is, but I sure as hell (pun intended) know what mine would be. If I go to hell, I will be completely imobile. I will not be able to move or speak. I will be constantly stung by bees and wasps, and acid will be shot into my veins and bone marrow via painful needles. Daddy long legs will crawl over me, and their legs will burrow into my skin. Those creepy little scarab things from The Mummy will gnaw at my brain and vital organs, yet I will never die, or pass out. I will be constantly and completely aware of my torments. All the things I did wrong in my life will play in my head in a constant loop. The smell of shrimp, sauerkraut, rotten eggs, and extremely cheap purfume will assail my nostrils. And providing a soundtrack to my torture, "She Thinks My Tractors Sexy" will play over and over and over (sort of like my mom did that one afternoon, when I first learned that hell would be sure to play country music).
I guess the basic foundation of my beliefs comes from my parents. I believe in heaven and hell, and Jesus, and that's from my mom (and even though my mom is a sunday school teacher, she also pseudo-believes in reincarnation and possibly other, lesser deities), but my dad is more skeptical, and I think I've inherited some of that, too. The outcome is that I have my own, sort of shoping cart religion, based off of my own thoughts and what feels right to me.
To get to hell, you've got to be really, really bad. Like Hitler bad, rapist, child abuser, or serial killer bad, and without once truly repenting. And by truly repenting, I don't mean, "Oh, crap, I'm probably going to hell, let me go make nice with God," I mean an extremely sincere, "Wow, I did some truly messed up things in my life, I'm sorry, I wish I could take back all that I did, I deserve to go to hell." I figure that there will be a test, and all the clearly bad people will be seperated from each other. Each of these people will be asked, "Well? You're going to hell. Tell me why." The people who cry and snivel, and try to get out of their punishment and make excuses for their behavior go straight to their eternal torment. The people who stand straight and brave and sincerely say (the judges know who is sincere and who is not) "I'm sorry. What I did was horrible and inexcusable. I suck. Send me to hell right away; I deserve whatever's coming to me." get sent back to earth as a cockroach, or some other lower life form, and work their way back up the food chain until they reach human again. If they live a full, good, happy life, regardless of their religion, they get their own personalized heaven (for a personalized hell merits a personalized heaven; the universe must have balance). If they completely suck again, they get the same test, and hell or cockroach depends on what they say that time around. If the person was neither bad nor good (gray), or they are not ready to leave Earth behind, then that person gets sent back as a middle life form (cat, bird, dog, squirell, with their specific animal type all depending on how good or bad they were in life).
I think the idea of hell and heaven as spiritual places is more realistic. I think both exist on a seperate plane of existence, and that all (human and animals) souls, when they are no longer attatched to the body, go to the judgement plane. From there, the souls are sent to the Hell plane, the Heaven plane, or back to this plane on which we currently reside.
I do not believe in circles of hell, but rather in individualized hells for every truly horrible soul, as I have already gone into detail about in my blog. If a person only committed a lesser crime, they go back to earth.
I can easily reconcile the idea that God is the embodiment of love and grace yet imagine that it is through his word that people descend into hell. When I think about it, it is simple to categorize such a situation into two possibilities. 1) the person willfully uses the words of ANY religious doctrine and bends them to the purpose of their own evil. If this is what occurs, than said person will probably fail Judgement and go to hell, and it will be entirely the fault of the person, and not the fault of the religious doctrine. 2) the person was truly led astray by a religious doctrine, either by honestly believing a false doctrine (and to me a false doctrine is any based on hate and fear instead of love and peace), being decieved by a charismatic leader, or in some other way misunderstanding a religiou doctrine. This person is innately good, and will, at Judgement be most likely sent back to Earth to try again.
Wow, I got the first full blog! Hurray, I win!
Yes there is a hell. Welll I don’t really know exactly what Hell is like because I haven’t been there but I do have an idea…. Residents run through never-ending paths, trying day after day to get out. All you see are high fires. There is no oxygen, smoke suffocates you from the lowest floor to the highest of mountains. Hell tempts you with the smell of what you most loved on earth.
Why do I believe there is a Hell? Welll my mom took me to church from the time I was conceived to this day and age. I went to CCD (Sunday school) classes from first grade to eighth grade. Every year they pushed more and more on the topic of Hell. “It’s a very bad place where very bad people go…you don’t want to go there so don’t be bad!” “Those who murder their brother go to Hell…” etc. etc.
Who is condemned to the fires of Hell? Well that’s an easy question. Those who are thoughtless of others, who live for their own pleasure only, or choose not to live (I’m not just talking about suicide its more of those who have the chance to live experiences but choose to rot in their own living room).
Believe it or not, in my eyes Sheol is more realistic. It’s just that I’ve been pounded with this idea of live or die since forever really. And through my experience life is either do or don’t. You either are happy with your life or in disgust with it. Those who are in the middle will eventually go onto one of those sides. They have the choice to be eternally happy or eternally in contempt. If life is like this why not the afterlife? (Wow I just realized that was kinda from that song in Costal’s class)
Yes there is a different level of degree of punishment for different sins. In Hell you will be eternally contempt no matter what. They, the residents, all go through the same experience but some have extra details to their punishment such as having their skin burn in the fires of hell instead of just feeling the suffocation of the smoke throughout their body.
The worst sin is of course murder of a child because a child is innocent of all since he/she only has a few years of experience upon them. It shall be dealt with by second by second whippings, in the section of hell with the hottest fires, that burn his/her flesh and organs until they are so discombobulated that you can hardly tell that they are human, but they are still left “alive” through all of this pain and suffering that will never ever end.
No it’s not easy for me to be loving towards God after he punishes so many people but that is for my own reason entirely that I will not discuss here and yet for the strangest reason I still go to him for help…
Leonor the lizard o_O
dont read mine!
KTB
Firstly, let me start out by saying that I really hate this question. No offence to anyone, but I just don't like it. The main reason? I never gave Hell enough attention to actually form a personal image of it. To me, its so unimportant that I'd just rather stick to the popular norm of giant flaming pit, with devils and demons prancing around while sinners get burned alive. Now, just because this is what I accept as a "hell" doesn't mean I believe it. Why? Cause I don't believe in hell. In fact, I don't really even believe in a heaven. It is difficult to understand why, since the idea of these has been shoved down my throat since the very first day of my birth. As I am now, I led myself astray from these believes. As far as I know, and care, once we die, the body rots in the grown as it is devoured by hideous worms and other such creatures. The soul, however, gets recycled and is reborn into a new life. This cycle never ends, and the sould suffers through the torturous events that occur in life, to no end. In retrospect, Heaven is a really nice idea. On our death beds, I would think that we all stare into the cealing, and say to ourselves "God is going to pay me back for all my hardwork with a wonderful utopia." That idea is nice as long as you believe that God is a "good" guy. I don't, most of the time I feel that we are all just puppets in God's little playpen. We amuse "It" throught our neverending cycle of hurting each other and the living things around us. Not to mention the way we went about screwing up the planet, top-notch. Quite frankly, I do not know where these believes came from and I don't know how long they will stay. At the end of the day, I am one of those people who will change little details of his beliefs to better suit my desires.
For the second question, I am going to have to side with the "final destination" choice. Sadly, I don't think when we die, there is a judge revealing to us whether we have been good little boys and girls, or not. As humans, we together are destined to go to one, if any, spiritual plane. Whether the human race has actually shown great signs of "good" or we just constantly screwed up one thing after another, we all confront the destiny together.
There is no "one worst sin", and as such, there are no levels of hell or any other supposed class divisions for such a place. On our level, of course we would see some sin's as worse than others. Obviously going on a murderous rampage at a mall is a bigger crime than...oh..say...cheating on your significant-something-or-other. But, notice that I used the word crime, not sin. Crime is an invention of man. It is a word that signifies the breaking of a written rule. A sin is much much different. In my opinion, sin acts in a funny way. You can be good all your life. Help all who around you, have respect for all things, you can even pray to good ol' God everyday, _BUT_ , it only takes one time. It only takes one time for your heart to dwell deep inside one of the 7 sins, for God to forsaken you from any "eternal joy" and send you into a "fiery pit" known as HELL.
Lastly, I don't think I even need to address the final question. The whole time I have been writing this, I've had the knowledge of God's cruel acts. God does what everyone with power does, He Abuses It.
Well, my head hurts right about now, so have a good night everybody.
I've given more thought to this than I probably should have. I was raised Catholic, baptized, reconciled, communion-ized and confirmed. But I haven't set foot in a church since my confirmation and cannot honestly say I believe in God. There are too many flaws in the system. For instance, according to the Catholics, yes, Sarah, Hitler is in Hell.
So is Gandhi.
I don't see it as right to condemn people who lead good lives just because they were brought up a different religion than Catholic. Now I'm not saying this for the believers in the class to hurl scripture at me, I've read the Bible twice, straight through, and I doubt there's much you could tell me about my church that could defend them from some of the issues I have with them. But that's beside the point. Due to the whole all-non-Catholics-go-to-Hell thing, I kind of stopped believing there was such a place.
And if there's no Hell, why would there be a Heaven, or a God? Questions like these often occupy my insomniatic mind, late at night when all happy thoughts have gone to bed. However, I've found I'm also adverse to the after-we-die-we-just-rot-in-the-ground theory. I find it depressing. I really plan to do a lot of good in my life, particularly pertaining to children and the young of the next generation, and I'd like to think that-since I don't really want a lot of recognition for my work in this lifetime- something after this will allow me a peace and happy sense of fulfillment I've wanted for so long.
As for Gehenna and sheol. I think that the idea of a hell on earth sounds ten times more plausible than the idea of another plane your soul travels to after you die. I think perhaps, if I were to have beliefs, I would lean more towards the idea that this life IS our Hell. This is the part we struggle and fight and hurt to get through, and our next life will be the easy, carefree, Heaven-like state. But I have no beliefs, so of course that above is irrelevant.
As for Alighieri's Inferno, since I don't believe in Hell I can't really believe in circles of hell. That makes sense, right? And since I don't believe in religion, sin is inconsequential. However, I do find that the worst thing a person can do is probably hurting a child. I find nothing more offensive than the disregard for innocence and life that child abusers (yet I'm still pro-choice concerning abortion. odd, no?).
And finally, I do not see God as an embodiment of love and hope and all that. This is, as I explained, one of the main reasons I have so little faith in any and everything. Here's the trip up though. I really really wish I had faith. I wish I believed that if I followed the rules and listened to a certain book or leader, that I would be happy for eternity. It's a wonderful idea, the picture of a kind, loving and forgiving figure watching over our everyday lives, but I just can't buy it.
All in all, though there were no questions concerning this, I feel the need to clarify: I have come to the conclusion, after much thought, that if I am a good person, and do good things, that it does not matter what happens after I die. If I live my life the way I want to, the way I plan to, then the cosmos can do with my soul as they will, because I will be content.
I have never really thought about this topic, nor do I think that I ever wanted to. But here I go! I do believe that hell exists. But I think that I only believe in hell, because I don’t want to think that there may be another place where the offenders go. When I envisioned hell, I pictured it as a place with fire everywhere, and more like a jail. Everyone is confined in their own cell, and not able to have contact with anyone for the rest of their time. I think those who have done something so horrible that they are in hell must pay for their sins and sit alone for the rest of eternity, dwelling on their past. Since you are dead, you don’t get food or water, or any contact with others. So you just sit there with only yourself to keep you entertained.
While there, you would feel such a sense of loneness that you lose who you truly are and you will never be able to forget the horrible crimes you have committed in your lifetime. In my hell, there wouldn’t be any smell or any noise, just complete silence. Silence is one of those things that make you think. Think about where you are and who you are. In hell, you would have no sense. No sight, no smell, no hearing, no sense of touch, or taste. You are physically handicapped, but you still have your mental capacity. You are still able to remember the sins that you have committed. I don’t know where my view of hell came from, since I have a very different outlook on life than my parents. I think I came up with this idea on my own, with my own idea on what the ultimate punishment would be. In order to get to hell, you have to do something so horrible in your lifetime that everyone around you feels affected, and everyone has lost respect for you as a person. Whether it may be committing a crime or breaking a coveted promise, you did something so disgusting, you went against your morals, and you caused pain in everyone around you.
I believe in the Sheol. Because I agree on the face that some people, or spirits after their death, who have committed the ultimate crime will face everlasting contempt. Everyone will always remember them as that horrible person, overlooking whatever great things they may have done in their lifetime. Although I am kind of shaky on the everlasting life part, I do agree with it in some aspect. If you were an amazing person, morally right, during your lifetime, you will always be remembered by someone for your good deeds and the impact you had on the world.
I don’t believe that there are varying degrees of sin. To me, sinning isn’t just lying to your parents or stealing a candy bar, it is much more. It is when you go against your morals, and you know what you did was wrong and will hurt the ones around you, either physically or mentally. Because of my belief in sin, whoever has committed some sort of sin should go to hell and suffer in the same degree. If you have done something horrible, to the point that you have hurt the people that you love, you deserve to be punished, even if the crime may have seemed to be not as awful, I am sure there was someone in your life that was affected by it and can attest that it changed their life for the worst.
I think it is easy to believe that God is the one that sends you to hell. To me, everyone has their own destiny, and God chooses your life path for you. So even if it may seem that sending someone to hell is the worst punishment, and as awful as it may be, God is doing it because he knows that it is the right thing for you. He has your best interest in heart, and by sending you to hell he is teaching you a lesson that you obviously couldn’t learn any other way while you were alive.
Fiona, according to my beliefs (which are sort of personalized to me; just like heaven and hell) Gahndi is in Heaven, or if he preferred, he was reborn. And since you are amazing, you, too, get your own perfect heaven (or live again on Earth, if you prefer).
I would like to believe that Hell in fact does exist. No one can really be certain, but even though it does sound disturbing and morbid, I hope it exists just for the sake that the soul after the body dies lives on in some way. If there is a Hell then there must be a Heaven, and I would hope that after I die I will go to Heaven. These days I have considered myself agnostic or at least I think I am. I want to believe in a God but I don’t necessarily follow any certain religion. I don’t agree with the views of Catholicism which is the religion I was raised. I like to hold my own beliefs and ideas of what God is. I want to think of God as loving and kind though sometimes it is difficult when you look at the world around you. There are so many poor innocent people being shot to death and tragic events like that that it makes me question whether God is good or even existent. I want to believe in a God because it gives me faith, despite my doubts. It gives me something to keep my morals balanced. Also, I think that the idea of God is someone to turn to when nothing is going right. Lately I have had the mindset that everything happens for a reason. It just keeps me positive and thinking that God is compassionate and has reasons behind his actions. I think since I was raised in a Catholic family, the idea of a heaven and hell were instilled into my beliefs. I want to believe that thought because I don’t want my soul to end or die with my body. I want to think that after we are gone, we don’t spiritually die as well.
Alighieri in his poem Inferno has several interesting views. The idea of the nine circles of Hell is strangely fascinating to think of that as a possibility, but I disagree with this viewpoint. No one is perfect. I am sure that everyone in this world has made many mistakes over the course of their lifetime. Everyone commits sins, whether major or minor depends on a person’s moral code, but no one goes sinless through their lives. If Alighieri ideas were factual then everyone would be stranded in Hell for eternity. In my sixteen, almost seventeen, years of living the worst things I have done are telling lies on occasion, maybe gossiping here and there, and then other trivial things along those lines. I have never killed a man or shanked a stranger on the street. I have never stolen anything, unless you count that key chain in France but that was only like one euro. I have never done anything that I think is an awful moral offense, so I really don’t think I haven’t done anything that would constitute going to Hell, despite what Hilary thinks (love you jerk :). Eternal damnation is for the most horrific people in the world, some examples are Hitler, Charles Manson, Jeffrey Dahmer, or OJ Simpson. Things that those people did are unforgivable and I don’t think a person can be redeemed after committing such atrocities. In my eyes, I think Hell is different for everyone. It is not a specific place with an address but merely subject to each person. It is a place where your worst nightmares come alive and torture you. It would be a place that you cannot escape from. My own personal Hell would be utter darkness with no one else there. Hell for me would be alone and not know where I am or what is happening, overwhelming, pitch black darkness. I hate being by myself for long periods at a time. Sometimes it is nice as a break from everyone, but I start to get nervous when I am alone. I like the comfort of others. Sometimes silence is just so intense that it makes me feel like I am going crazy. I know that in Hell, I wouldn’t be with anyone else, therefore probably pushing me towards a mental breakdown and eventual craziness. I don’t plan on living in eternal darkness because I never plan on committing a crime or doing anything that severe that would require such a horrible punishment.
In response to Sarah, I definitely understand your views on the whole idea of Hell and I completely agree. Like you I believe that there are “individualized hells for every truly horrible soul.”
Sergei, I think your views on this topic were very interesting and your blog really made me think. I like that you think that there is no worse sin and I agree. The idea that the human race is judged as one is fascinating to me. I never thought of it like that and how maybe you can live your whole life right, but still go to Hell because of one little thing. This blog was so thought provoking because no one does know the real answer.
Oh and Billy Cheatham, KTS!
OKAY, BEFORE ANYONE ELSE COMMENTS THEY MUST READ THE LYRICS TO THIS SONG "BEELZ" BY SINGING COMEDIAN STEVEN LYNCH:
"(Spoken)
I figured since I wrote a song about you know God and Jesus and all that I would have to give the opposition equal time.
(Sung)
Ever since first man has walked this Earth I have been here
To whisper seeds of doubt and evil thoughts into his ear
I am the beast, the outcast angel fallen from on high
I go by many names by there is one you can't deny
My name is Satan, hi everybody!
Ahh, let me tell you a little about myself
My friends all call me old scratch and I am a Capricorn
My turn ons are romantic walks and killing the unborn
I've got little devil horns, and a little Goatee,
Little devil eyes to help a little devil see
Little cloven hoofs that make it kinda hard to ski
I'm Satan, Woo Hoo!
Mephistopheles for some. I don't know.
My real name is Beelzebub, but you can call me Beelz
I love to watch Fox news and then go club some baby seals
Then I'll take a bubble bath and drink a zinfandel
Try to wash off that baby seal smell
And then I'll make a toast to me
Hey, here's to my hell...th
My name is Satan. Ah Hah!
To carry on my evil ways I went and had a son
And now he makes his living as a singing comedian
I'm in every Zeppelin album
I'm in all Rush Limbaugh's rants
I'm the reason that the Boston Red Sox even had a chance
And if I want to eat your soul, I'll just throw it on a griddle.
I don't need to make a deal, I don't need to tell a riddle
And f*ck Charlie Daniels I don't care if he can fiddle
I'm Satan.
The Devil went down to Georgia, he was looking for a soul to steal
Thats f*cking b*llsh*t because I wouldn't be caught dead in Georgia
Ok, it's like Oh my God!
Six, Six, Six!
(Spoken)
Satan! Look, that's just how I picture him. You f*cking think of whatever you want."
It's even better if you can listen to this song. Hilarious, and presents a fun take on Satan and Hell.
This is a topic that’s bothered me for SO many years. I am a “confirmed” catholic, I suffered eight long, tedious years of CCD (which is Hell in disguise), and I can honestly say I do not believe in God or any of the aspects relating to the religion. Simply put, I do not believe in Heaven, so I do not believe in Hell either. The two must go hand-in-hand. This doesn’t mean that I can’t interpret what Heaven and Hell may be like. I like making up my own beliefs, and for a while I believed that our time on Earth right now is “Hell” and whatever afterlife our soul, energy, or “body” may encounter is “Heaven”. But now I don’t even like that idea, so I make up my own rules for reincarnation and live by that. And just throwing it out there, this will probably be my worst blog yet, only because I have such strong opinions on the subject and can’t help but rant about religion altogether, so it’s going to be quite disorganized. So bear with me =].
But back to Hell. I don’t know what it looks, smells, or feels like. Do you? If you say “yes” because of what your bible, scripture, deity, or God has told you, I’m sorry to say, but that’s bull. I’m not trying to degrade anyone’s religion, and I know I may be ignorant at times, but with all honesty, I’m just trying to be straightforward. Because when it comes down to it, no one knows what Hell is like, so why should anyone believe in it or its stereotypes? As a used-to-be-Catholic (wow, if I knew how to officially un-catholicize myself, I totally would), I learned that Hell was a horrid place where people who commit the worst of sins go, along with the people who don’t follow our religion (That’s where I was like—yeah, Catholicism is a joke). All I learned from CCD was that religion, God, Heaven, and Hell are all a human-created theories with no scientific evidence, which are only used to induce relief and hopefulness (again, what a joke) for people who are too afraid to face death. Now, I am afraid of death, I won’t deny that, but c’mon. To believe that our minds and souls live forever in a perfect kingdom of “He who created our world in 7 days” is extremely far-fetched. It’s even more implausible to believe that God, who is so “holy, kind, and understanding”, would send his own creatures to a never-ending cycle of torture.
Now, my strong opinions on religion, in my eyes, are understandable. How would you like being forced to go to CCD every week for 8 years, gaining nothing but the memorization of a few prayers? Each year I became more and more confused. I had horrible teachers, who did nothing but try and shove the “teachings of God” down my throat. All I ever wanted to know was “why” and “how” and “what”, but no one could ever explain it to me. Why do we have a heaven? How come we can just go and list all of our sins to a priest, say a few Hail Mary’s and Our Father’s, and all of a sudden God forgives us for all we’ve done? What happens to babies if they die before they’re born, do they go to heaven? What do we look like when we go to heaven? How long do we stay there for, because it seems boring after a while? Why do we punish those who don’t believe in our religion, even if they were good people? These questions, and so many more, I’ve asked on numerous occasions to my CCD teachers, and no one could ever give me a definitive, logical answer (and half the time they’d ignore me). I know now that no one could answer my questions because in reality, no one knows. And I sure as hell am not going to base my life off of God’s teachings because people tell me that if I don’t follow his word then I’ll go to Hell. I’ll believe what I want, so everyone else can believe whatever the heck they want.
I’ve noticed I kind of went off topic, but basically: No, I don’t believe in Hell. I don’t know what it looks, smells, or feels like, and I really don’t even care. It’s unrealistic and illogical. I blame my church and religion for my ignorance and apathetic views toward Hell, and anything associated with God. There’s nothing to do to get there because there’s no such place. But hypothetically speaking, you have to commit a mortal sin or something.
Neither Gehenna nor Sheol sound realistic to me, big surprise. Why? Because I’m too stubborn to accept, acknowledge, or even consider any beliefs other than my own.
I actually own the book The Divine Comedy by Dante, but haven’t gotten around to reading past the first 5 pages. I want to read it, not because I agree with his beliefs, but because I find it interesting (in a “this is ridiculous, I have no idea how any one could believe this crap” kind of way). Since I don’t believe in Hell, I don’t believe that our sins matter, at least not in relation with the afterlife.
WARNING: If you love God, and are easily offended, don’t read this next part =].
I think God is a joke. Let me get this straight, God created man and already knows how our lives are going to play out, correct? Supposedly, no matter what we do, that was how God wanted it to happen, anyway. So, why would God punish those that committed sin or didn’t believe in Him, because didn’t he create them? Since he created them, isn’t he the one that’s responsible for what they do and believe in? Again, these are some questions that I’ve asked my CCD teachers, but they just gave me a death stare and turned away. But seriously, the concept of God is illogical. This loving and caring “Creator of Earth and life” has the nerve to deem some our mistakes as “sins” and makes some people go through eternal suffering, when he created them. If I believed in the Devil, I don’t think He and God would be very different. Yeah, that may be a little “extreme”, but it’s my belief.
Do I believe hell exists? Well let me just forewarn anyone who reads this that I will probably severely offend you...so BE WARNED!
Basically what this question asks is if I believe that if I don't act by the rules of an unknown deity my soul will forever burn and be tormented in a fiery pit? Then no, I do not believe in hell. Of course as a "Christian" for years I was branded with the ideals and values of the catholic faith so I have a pretty good idea of what they want you to believe. Basically it's a deep dark cavern pervaded by the sounded of dreadful screams and the sickly sweet scent of decaying bodies and human gelatin. It's a place where you experience unimaginable pain while being tortured by the henchmen of Lucifer. Fortunately I don't believe in this nonsense or else I might be afraid of ending up there.
If this place were to exist I think it would exist as depicted by the Old Testament in Sheol. It would not be a physical place as we have to think about the logistics of fitting all those bodies into one place. And spiritual torture sounds much more foreboding then bodily harm.
I don't believe in sins or levels of hell as I stated earlier. I have no practical reason for not believing but then again, it's impractical to believe in it in the first place. Why do people dismiss faerie tales and dragons but except an all powerful omnipresent being as creating all existence? There are also moral problems with hell and the process of being sent to it. Apparently this god has the perfect values and morals and because he so god damn right about everything we should emulate his actions? Well how about we hold up for a second and consider how idiotic that is. Someone just declared that their opinions are right, you have to believe in them or else you will be tortured for eternity. Wow that sounds remarkably like someone I know, yeah that’s right Hitler. Who gave this guy the right to declare his opinions better than everyone else’s? Remember that time when we all voted on what was morally acceptable? Yeah me neither. I refuse to believe that this being is going to judge me by his views of right and wrong and then punish me for not believing in what he does, that's just flat out wrong. As I’ve said in many other blogs, right and wrong are decided by the individual. One person perspective of justice could be another’s malice. There is no defining line, and as such how can one base a religion off of speculation. I find religion in its entirety to be bologna. Remember, Oscar Meyer has a way with b-o-l-o-g-n-a.
And when you think about it religion, at least in Christianity, is hypocritical of himself. A god who is supposed to love you no matter what can send you to rot away in the recesses of hell? That’s not love, that's fascism! Since I’ve already blown through the lines of political correctness I’ll reveal a few more of my opinions. If you haven't already derived this from my rant I think that religion is based off of fear. The basis of it all is fear of the wrath of a god, fear of hell, fear of sin and death. This can be traced all the way back to the Egyptians fear of their deities. Especially in this century people only act the 'right way" because of fear of the consequences. It’s so easy to follow everyone else like a freaking sheep as long as you have a delusion that you are going to heaven. If you don't have enough pride and confidence in yourself to act the way you want, then go ahead and be another sheep. But when reality stalks up and faces you one on one you'll have no one to go to. The sheep has been following all the others for so long that it forgets how to act when the wolf is hunting it.
In response to Fiona:
Hah that’s a great point to add to my arsenal against the Christian crusade of world dominance. The fact that no matter how good of a person you are by their standards, if you don't believe in god you are going to hell. the fact that you, and so man y others wrote in their posts about how they were forced out of Christianity by its strictness only confirms that there is something fundamentally wrong with the way that the church runs. Children who are still young and pure can see through all this holy bullshit and look directly at the truth.
I wont believe in heaven and hell.
No saints, no sinners,
No devil as well.
No pearly gates, no thorny crown.
Youre always letting us humans down.
The wars you bring, the babes you drown.
Those lost at sea and never found,
And its the same the whole world round.
The hurt I see helps to compound,
That the father, son and holy ghost,
Is just somebodys unholy hoax,
And if youre up there youll perceive,
That my hearts here upon my sleeve.
If theres one thing I dont believe in...
Its you,
Dear god.
I grew up Catholic. My parents sent me to CCD once a week, every Monday night for an hour and a half. My family went to church quite often when I was growing up. Not every Sunday, but close enough. So, I have a sense of understanding and acceptance of religion enstilled in me, whether I like it or not. Although I'm not the most religious person ever (I rarely go to church anymore) I have my own set of beliefs that I live by, and I don't need the Catholic Church to tell me what to think and what not to think. I don't need anyone to tell me, for that matter. I believe whatever I need to, and it honestly changes from day to day. Still, I don't feel the need to iron out the kinks in my views on religion, as I feel they are ever-changing, and one day everything just might make sense to me...maybe. However, I'm perfectly content with my own beliefs, and I feel as though everyone is entitled to their own beliefs as well. So yeah, that's my religion thing...now, on to Hell.
I believe in Hell to a degree. I don't think of it as a permanent settlement, however. It's more of a place where you go, after you die, to repent for your mistakes. If they are minute, you're in and out in no time. Major? You may be there a little longer. I know, I probably sound silly, but this is what I think. People deserve at least some punishment for their sins while on Earth. I'm mainly refering to murderers, or those who inflict major pain or violence on others. I cannot accept that these people aren't punished in the afterlife. At the same time, I'm not content in believing that they spend their whole afterlife in Hell. How do I solve this little contradiction??
Well, everyone ends up in Heaven, because everyone has good in their hearts. Everyone. We are a product of our environments to a certain degree. So, there are decisions we make that aren't always our fault. Yes, if someone is a murderer, they deserve punishment. But do they deserve it forever? No. Because maybe they suffered the death of a loved one, or rape, or an abusive parent. You just never know. People act as a result to the stress's and trauma's of their lives. To sentence people to an afterlife of burning in Hell is not what I like to believe God does. Everyone is given the chance to fix things, and when they have done some self evaluation and made peace, they are permitted to Heaven.
I don't think of Hell as a burny, fiery pit or anything like that. Rather, a place to go and reflect. About your mistakes in life, and what you did wrong. A time-out of sorts. A chance to make everything better. Then, after you have been through all this, you can go to Heaven, and stay forever.
I probably sound really strange, but it's hard to put into words what I believe. Because it's in my head and my heart, and it's not something that can easily be expressed through words. I just like to believe in God. It helps me get through the day, and I have other personal reasons for believing in Him and in the afterlife. However, I don't always agree with the church. My opinions about the afterlife and religion are my own, and nobody has to understand or like them or anything. I just prefer to believe, because what else do we have? Hope is so important to me, so I choose to think of Hell and Heaven and God the way that I need to. If I didn't, I would feel so empty, lost, and desperate. There has to be more out there. I know there's more out there. A particular experience has taught me this, and that's all I need. Just wait until my occasional paper, and you might become a believer too...maybe :)
To begin, I do believe in Hell. I have my own feelings about it but other than that, I don’t have the slightest clue as to what it looks, smells, or feels like. I think that the best possible day in Hell is about 1 million times worse than the worse day on Earth. I imagine Hell being a vast, endless prison. Each condemned soul has its own “cell.” Each day, all of the souls are tortured as they are forced to relive their worst memories and fears over and over again. The worst part, they have no memory of love or of the people they cared about, making the endless torment even more unbearable, as they have nothing to distract them from stabs of pain and sorrow that slowly overtake their soul. I also think there is no interaction between anybody, creating an immense loneliness that only adds to the anguish of the tormented souls. The flames of Hell inflict every imaginable physical torture on the souls as chastisement for their misdeeds committed on Earth. The smell of burnt flesh and brimstone fills the air with a thick haze. The screams of the damned are the only noise heard in the fiery pit of desolation.
My belief has stemmed from a few places: parents, church, and a few of my own ideas. I have been taught Catholicism since I was in first grade and have repeatedly questioned some of its ideals and beliefs but ultimately have stuck with it for the most part. As Fiona has mentioned, one of the major themes of the Catholic bible is that non-Catholics are to be eternally damned, along with homosexuals, and many others. The thing is, I don’t necessarily agree with that, and neither do most Catholics or the Pope.
I feel I must explain a little bit of Bible history. Ok, so the Bible, from what I know, was partially written as a means to control the people of Europe. It was highly specific in what was considered acceptable and what wasn’t. Rome also desired to increase its power, so, the Bible was worded with the intent to create converts to religion and strengthen the Catholic Stronghold of Rome. This is the main reason why the bible, a book filled with understanding and wisdom, seems to contradict itself by stating the damnation of all non-Catholics. In order to do this, the Romans confiscated all bibles, not that there were many, and edited and reworked to spiritual guide in order to fit their intentions. Thus the reason why the Bible is so harsh, the Roman Empire wanted to shape the people and control them. Originally, the bible was not written like this.
That’s that, it doesn't justify the harashness only brings it the reason behind it to light. So, I think that because of this little dandy, the Bible is highly coercive and everyone needs to realize that the lessons and morals it provides are far more important than its choices on what religion is best. One of the main laws is love God. I think this is universal and if you believe there is a God, than however you worship him (or her), whether it is Catholicism or Judaism or Buddhism or Hinduism, is acceptable. And God, being an all-knowing deity, I think, would find it in his heart to forgive us if we aren’t completely correct in our beliefs.
With that said, I think, as my faith partially tells me, only those whom have committed a serve sin are cursed to live out eternity in Hell. This includes murder, of any caliber, although I feel people have the right to choose whether or not the wish to kill the unborn. I also feel that any major crime could also lead to a life sentence in the underworld. I think petty crimes that occur once or maybe twice or forgivable, as I am taught. However, if they constantly continue, the person obviously has no remorse, and is just as bad as a murder.
I think a spiritual destination is more likely. I however, as a Catholic, don’t think that it is a direct path to Heaven or Hell. I have been taught that in between the physical plane and spiritual one is a place of Purgatory. Here, the souls of those who committed human misdeeds of less severity are purged and sins are removed. I think that, this is my personal belief, we live purgatory everyday. In order to have a clean slate and be welcomed to Heaven, I believe we have to wrong the misdeeds we did. In order to do that, we relive our lives over and over, until we get it right. This would explain the strange feeling of Déjà vu, it is some spiritual signaling that tells us when we are encountering an act we need change. Of course, being flawed creatures, this process would take a long time. That’s just my opinion. So to restate my answer, Heaven and Hell are definitely spiritual but the cleansing of our souls, I think, is earthly. I really don’t see how either could be on earth. There is too much malevolence to be Heaven and too much selflessness and caring to be Hell. However, it contains enough of both to be a learning and purifying journey.
I disagree with Alighieri to an extent. I don’t think there are varying intensities of Hell. I think, if you are sent there you will suffer as much as the next person. This is because I feel only the severest and most horrific sins earn a one-way ticket to underworld. I do, however think that there are varying intensities of purification. The less evil committed that has to be absolved the easier and more rewarding is life, on the flip side, a highly sinful life will be meet with a stressful and sometimes hopeless purification process. And as my stance would suggest, I don’t think there is a “worst sin”. I do think that to deal with these pains souls become subject to physical torture as part of their sentence for the crimes they committed on Earth.
Lastly, is it easily reconcilable to think of God as being the embodiment of love and grace yet imagine that it is through his word that people descend into hell, which is, ostensibly, a place of eternal suffering?
This is definitely a question I ponder on a daily basis. And truthfully, I have yet to come up with an answer. The only explanation for this seemingly harsh paradox is that God, according to my religion, will forgive you as many times as you commit a sin as long a you feel remorse and try to stop it from happening again. He gives unlimited chances at forgiveness. He is always willing to welcome the lost back. And I can only guess that God gives us the choice whether or not to repent many times in our life. If we choose not to take advantage of his mercy than so be it. As a famous quote states “it is not the destination but the journey” and I can’t help but feel it readily applies here. God, if you believe, gave us freewill in order to experience life and learn right from wrong because of his willingness to forgive. He wants us to develop our own character but still stay true to morals and values. He knows that’s hard and that’s why he is so forgiving.
That’s my opinion feel free to attack it.
To Jen:
I know how you feel. Having many of your burning questions shrugged off and you made to feel like an outsider. I have questioned the religon many times as well. But the truth is, no one can answer those questions. They are merely opinions if a human were to answer them. So I understand your frustration but not every question has a direct answer.
This is my actual post, but man, I just really want to comment on Matt Capone's blog! You tell it like it is!!! I think you make a very good argument about your belief that there is no God. And the connection of God to Hitler, awesome. I just wanted to say that really... awesome blog, and if I could ditto your blog for my own, I would. Though I'd probably say that I absolutely don't believe in God because it's nice to think about, but yea... ^_^ Kudos!
*This is not supposed to offend or anything...
*isn't my actual post. Sorry!!!
sarah c <3
I've heard about your famous blog posts and since urs was right above mine why not read it right?
I love when you describe your hell. No offence to all those country lovers but country music is ... AHHHHH! I hate it! I just want to bang my head against the wall! And your hell is pretty painful. How do you come up with these forms of torture? I'm jealous!
WEll I'm tired... bye!
Matt Capone:
Yes, it is true that I have yet to read your blog, but I'm sure it will be amazing. This comment, however, has little to do with it: I saw CCD at the top of your section and I was like 'Must comment!'. So here's to you, Matt Capone, for making all those years of CCD worth while, because just remembering all the poor teacher's faces, shocked and shaken that logical arguments were being made against god in CCD... oh those were the times. The horrible, awful, only made tolerable by your ridicule, times.
haha before I even comment I just want to say matt capone, bro you are the funniest kid I know. That little note to god, was probably not intended to make someone laugh, but I just laughed for five minutes. Straight. Thank you for that
Then again I just laughed for 15 minutes straight at Spongebob, so I'm unsure if your actually funny Matt or I'm just delirious.
“I don't think of Hell as a burny, fiery pit or anything like that. Rather, a place to go and reflect. About your mistakes in life, and what you did wrong. A time-out of sorts. A chance to make everything better. Then, after you have been through all this, you can go to Heaven, and stay forever.”
Devon- I think that this paragraph of yours is very well said. Like I mentioned in my entry, I think Hell is a place where one goes to think about the sins they have committed in their lifetime. Although I do disagree with you on the fact that everyone goes to heaven, the way you portrayed hell was exactly what I was thinking!
Jordan! When are you coming back?! I miss you! Hope you feel better.
P.S. Craig admitted that he missed you today in calc!
You know, for some reason, in my sleep-deprived haze of last week, I was going to rant about my spiritual beliefs. Don't remember how it was supposed to fit, but I decided against it, and just in time it looks like.
I was born and raised a roman catholic. I went through the same process Fiona did, being brought (forced) to church every Sunday. I've been baptized and confirmed and all the other things that come along with it. I haven't been a day in the last year, and I'm glad of it. I don't believe in it. It's too absolute. Anything that teaches you that one mistake you don't tell to a priest, and be officially absolved of will damn you to the eyes of god is ridiculous to me. Plus, Catholicism, and anything involving the new testament, is much too contradictory. I don't have trouble reconciling a god who is ultimately benevolent sending people to hell. I have a problem reconciling the ideas that a god can be completely benevolent and loving and also indiscriminately murder hundreds of people when he destroyed Saddam and Gomorrah. Excuse me. Hmm... And Jen reminded me. If god has a plan, and you end up going to hell because of said plan, that would make him one sick little retard, wouldn't it?
So I scratched that idea, pulled out a shopping cart, and set off down the aisles. Somehow I managed to get the idea of a heaven, a hell, and reincarnation all in there together. Not exactly sure how that happened. I do believe in a hell, but it's less hell and more time-out. Hell is a prison, plain and simple. It's unbearably hot and completely silent. Humans are social critters. Hell would deny this aspect. You would be able to see, but you would see little besides the coffin-like cell you were entombed in. You could not move, breathe, talk, think, hear, scream, eat or drink, but all the needs of this world would remain intact. If you didn't go completely nuts by this point, then congrats, you get unleashed back into the world for a second attempt. Your time in the nutbox is determined by how big a scumbag you were in life. Killed a baby with your bare teeth? Twice as long as someone who stole a big-screen TV. Steal a loaf of bread because you were starving? Free pass. I really don't think people should be punished because they did what they had to to survive.
And as to the Gehenna/Sheol comparison, I think Sheol is much more realistic. I don't think your body carries on with you to the next life, staying here to help out the next generation instead. So why would there be a physical place for a body you won't hang on to?
As to Dante, not only does he have a wicked cool name, I really like his idea of different levels of punishment for different levels of sin, and completely and shamelessly stole it for my own. (See above.) What's the worst sin? I don't think that any act is worse than another, but the reasons behind them vary in evil. I don't think someone who steals a loaf of bread, or even a pizza, just to have something to eat that night should be punished much, if at all, but someone who stole your watch or cell phone or DS or whatever just to have it should rot for a long time. Even Hitler, who, as we all know, killed millions of people, doesn't deserve as much as, say, Stalin, because Hitler killed who he did because he was trying to help Germany. That deserves much less time in the box than Stalin, who killed twice as many people as Hitler did just because he was a paranoid old crazy. The Zodiac is one of the few who I can't see as deserving of redemption, because he did not repent at all. In fact, according to his own admission, he killed the sixteen or so people he killed so he could have slaves in the afterlife. So the worst sin would be selfishness. Doing horrible things can be justified if they're done for the public good, but when they're only done for selfish gain or paranoia there is no justification, and thus, the hardest redemption.
And I think that's all for now. But two things.
One, to Matt Capone, you're hardcore. Your condemnation of god as a bully is something I completely agree with. And to Devon. I've known you way too long. I'm not sure why, but your idea of hell as an impermanent and reflective place was so in line with my basic idea I feel like I'm plagiarizing from you. I salute you both.
Well, I must admit that this was not really all that unexpected. After
all, we did read an entire descriptive essay on Hell and one of our
options for our essay was describing Heaven. Sounds good to me!
While doing some reading over the week end, I found out something
interesting about Hell. It's an actual place! Now I'm not talking
about the place ruled by the Devil and filled with demons, but it is
rather similar. Hell, also known as Gehenna, gi'innom, and Sheol in
the Old and New Testaments of the Bible, was an actual place. Gehenna
and gi'innom, which translate to "Valley of Hinnom", was located
outside of southern Jerusalem and was used as a waste receptacle for
garbage and for the bodies of condemned and executed criminals. Sheol,
from the word which means "to make hollow," was similar to Gehenna in
the sense that it was a place used to hold the bodies of the dead and
trash. So in the debate of "is hell a real place" a correct answer
could be "yes." Or at least it was a real place since the Valley of
Hinnom was filled in when the city was extended onto as the population
grew.
But I would like to point out that this doesn't mean that when the
Bible preaches of Hell, it is not just simply talking about Gehenna; it
speaks about where the wicked go when they die. After all, in Number
16:30 it states "But if the Lord brings about an entirely new thing and
the ground opens its mouth and swallows them up with all that is
theirs, and they descend alive into Sheol, then you will understand
that these men have spurned the Lord."
I think that it would seem redundant for me to state that Hell is a
place of fire and brimstone and is filled with the souls of the wicked;
it's a given. What else would Hell be if not a place of eternal
torment and suffering? In the words of the late but great George
Carlin, "Hell is like setting a thousand Christmas trees on fire and
jumping right in the middle of it." Hell has fire. What else is new?
But what exactly is the correct interpretation of Hell? I can't help
but find myself leaning slightly more towards Dante's idea of the Seven
levels then that of the Bible's one giant flaming inferno of doom (doom
is the angelo-saxon word for "judgment" for those of you who don't
know. Cool no?) I say this simply for the fact that not everyone
commits that same level of sin. Someone who tells a lie is not as evil
as someone dressed in a bunny suit who kills a thousand people for the
heck of it. And for that matter, I also believe that Heaven is like
that too, containing more then just one level (after all, if there are
different degrees of evil, shouldn't there also be different degrees of
good? I mean, I'm a pretty good person but I'm no Mother Teresa.) But
that's getting off topic. I think that a fair god would create a place
of redemption, a Hell, that contained different levels simply because
it would be just. Why would someone we learn is just and omnipotent
force everyone who did a few mistakes, a few bad calls, in life suffer
the same way he would have Adolph Hitler suffer for his crimes? That
just wouldn't make sense.
And for that matter, I'm also rather keen on Purgatory. That seems
fair to me. You'd suffer the pains of Hell, but not for all of
eternity. That would be the greatest. You'd suffer and scream in
torment, but in the back of your head you'd know that it wouldn't be
forever. You'd know that one day you'd get to leave and go to Heaven.
How sweet is that?
The Fourth layer of Hell: you're trapped in a box with a runny nose
and all of the tissues are soggy! Oh noes! lolz!
"Some people feel like they don't deserve love. They walk away quietly into empty spaces, trying to close the gaps of the past."
— Chris McCandless
I don’t really believe that hell exists. If there is a hell, it’d be in our minds. We are the ones that create this “hell” in life, no one else does. We are the ones that came up with the idea of God. Was there anything about this higher power back then? Yes, people made him up. Wasn’t the book of God written by people? You’re going to take other people’s opinion and keep it as your own, thinking you won’t die in some blazing inferno if you abide by their rule, “God’s laws”? (I don’t mean to offend anyone!!!) But, yes, it is just in our minds. So many people live with unhappy circumstances just because they are used to it and they think that they deserve it, thus creating their own hell that they live in everyday. I find that a lot of teenagers are like this, over dramatizing their lives and saying that they’re “pretending” to be someone they’re not. Some even scream about how they hate their lives and how they just want it all to end. Of course, I am no exception but I don’t really hate my life. I do over dramatize but I think it’s because I want people to notice me sometimes that I would live in such a way that I would be unhappy everyday. I mean, recently I’ve gotten better because let’s face it—being in a self-created hell isn’t really that fun. I found it displeasing, but hey, to each their own. What I’m saying is that it’s really a mental thing. If we think everything is going horrible, everything will be horrible. If we think that we don’t deserve to be “saved”, we’ll keep going on about our lives, yelling to whoever will listen that we are d*mned. The power of the mind is great and affects everything we do. It’s like how athletes have to think they can in order to do their best. (Did I word that funny?)
Where did all of this come from? Well, my beliefs came from a variety of sources. My parents’ apathetic attitude towards religion helped me out a lot in choosing not to have one. For those that are screaming “you atheist!” at me, I won’t say I’m an atheist because I still believe that there is a deity (most likely because it’s a prettier thought, haha) somewhere far away. I have gone to some churches and cathedrals before and I have to say that the architecture and the paintings of the church in Vatican were pretty impressive and full of exquisite detail everywhere! It was gorgeous! The talk about Heaven and Hell made me come up with ideas for a manga and think a lot, so in a way I’m semi-Catholic—if that’s even possible. I just don’t really follow the Bible because it was written by the people. *this is offensive, please don’t read if devout Catholic* I mean, why should I read the Bible which was written by some people who decided to write down what some guy said? I just don’t think that it should be like a law that I have to follow. Plus, all the rules about being good and treating your neighbor like you would yourself, it’s just socially accepted principles. Feel free to disagree, of course, but it’s like the whole fairy tale thing. Do you honestly believe that Adam and Eve really existed in the Garden of Eden and after God kicked them out, He actually gave them some sort of rod that can magically summon sheep and sheepdog from the sea for Adam, but wolves for Eve? I think I’m getting out of hand here, but yea, back to the blog questions.
*Not as offensive anymore* Anyways, I got my beliefs from the churches, from people who share the same thoughts as I do and from just reading a little bit of the Bible. To get to hell, you just have to believe that everything in your life sucks and go around everyday, crying and hurting yourself because you’re a “bad” person. It’s all mental.
Gehenna and Sheol both don’t appeal to me. They both don’t really seem realistic, but I guess Sheol would be the better pick of the two since I don’t really understand the concept of the soul. I mean, do we really have this spirit that detaches from the body when we die or do we just die when our heart and brain stop functioning? Since I don’t believe in Hell as a place, Sheol seems more realistic. I mean, if it truly is a spirit that detaches from the body when we die, then the only place it can go is somewhere else on earth. Can a small cloud of spiritual stuff really beat the gravitational pull of the earth to go out into space? I don’t know, but I don’t think so. But truth is, I think that (since I sorta-but-not-really believe in God) if he was truly a nice God, he would allow people to be reborn if they truly had a bad life and made mistakes and had given up on life. I don’t think he’d put them in Hell or spiritual chains for eternity just because of that. I believe that he would give them a chance to live again, and hopefully live a better life this time. If he is truly a benevolent God, he would forgive, won’t he? No matter what the person did or said, wouldn’t it hurt Him more if He made them suffer? I don’t really know, I guess it’s just my own opinion over here.
Dante is the coolest character ever in Devil May Cry!!! Just kidding, I know who we’re talking about, but Dante’s still the coolest character in Devil May Cry! I don’t really believe in what Dante wrote in the “Inferno” with each of the crimes and its punishment in Hell. I just don’t think that, just because they don’t believe in his religion, he should put them in one of the circles of Hell. Everyone believes what they want and I don’t feel like his circles of Hell are acceptable. While I can understand that some of the crimes that he chose to be worse than others, I don’t think that the punishment should be administered in such a way. This is stupid and is entirely based on his opinion and how he thinks his religion is the best of all others, seeing as he punishes Muhammad and such. But I’ll admit, the ideas that he put forth are great and obviously had a lot of thought put into them. I really liked it. I don’t believe in this though, since I don’t believe in Hell or Heaven. Sins are bad and all, but I think that it really doesn’t matter because if that’s what they want to do, go ahead. If they want to break their morals and principles, I don’t care because I’m not them. It’s all good with me, though I’ll admit; Dante’s view on Hell is awesome and can be used by the Catholics to instill fear into people’s hearts. After all, people usually think about consequences more so than rewards when it comes to religion.
I don’t think that it is easily reconcilable to think of God as the embodiment of love and grace and then let him be all like “you’re going to hell, sinner!” I don’t know. If there really is a God and he is all these great things I hear about, I don’t think he would dear send his children to Hell. It’s like the ending of “The Omen”, where the father can’t kill the son of the Devil, who he has raised as his own son even though the child has killed his wife and their unborn child, when the child says “Please stop, father!!!” If God is truly benevolent, he would do the same. I know this whole blog most likely contradicted itself a lot, but I’m a skeptical believer (lol XD if that’s even possible). I don’t really know how to say it, but if you read Matt Capone’s blog, you’ll get the gist of why I am skeptical of God. Kudos again to you, Capone!
El Fin!
Now, I’m Buddhist, so the concept of heaven and hell don’t’ really apply to me. Unlike most people, I’ve come to the conclusion that I really don’t care if there is one or not. Because the funny thing is, you’re not going to know until you die. Now that isn’t to say I haven’t put time and thoughtinto the idea before. I’ve read the Bible before (an abridged one… which was still about god knows how long), and it was quite interesting. And I did attend church for a year when I was in 4th grade with a couple of friends. So I like to think I have a tiny tiny tiny platform for which to make an argument on.
Once again, I really don’t believe (or even care) that hell exists. If I did hypothetically, I like to picture lots and lots of fire. I don’t necessarily think it would smell bad, but smell like…. fire, which I think smells pretty nice. And due to the insurmountable amount of flames, I would assume it to be very muggy and humid. And I also like to think Satan isn’t actually that bad of a guy, but was misunderstood. This is totally in a South Park kind of way, for anyone who has seen it (this means Saddam Hussein is Satan’s former gay partner). He just got the wrong end of the stick from god, and somehow ended up underground. Then he met Saddam Hussein, and everything went downhill from there….
All jokes aside, I would imagine hell to be like what we see all the time in media. It’s a place where all the damned go to repent sins, and suffer eternally by being whipped, tortured, and being forced to watch Laguna Beach. I guess this representation comes from the general media, books I’ve read, and my own stupid mind. How you’d end up in hell is anyone’s guess, and personally, I have no guideline. I mean, you’d end up in hell for killing 16 valley girls, but would you go to hell for stealing a car? So if anyone wants to clear that up for me, that would be great.
And I also think hell is not an actual place, but more of a spiritual embodiment. It’s the embodiment of a life not fulfilled, or a life lived the wrong way. I’ve heard that the spirit lives on after you die, and perhaps hell is just a metaphorical idea representing of the lack of closure and a life lived badly. So I suppose in essence, ghosts are in an embodiment of hell. They haven’t reached "heaven” because they have not found peace. I really doubt hell can physically exist (well Jersey is pretty close) on Earth, so the spiritual embodiment makes the most sense to me. Probably not to you, but it does to me.
I believe any crime that ultimately makes you question your integrity is the biggest sin. I guess that would be different for each individual. So I’ll leave that up to interpretation. I think being a Packers fan should be condemned. No ifs or buts.
I’m not gonna argue whether god exists or not, because quite frankly, I don’t care. I have bigger things to worry about than to ask for answers to a question which I won’t find out until I die. I figured this out a looooooong time ago. I used to knock my head silly asking questions like this, and decided to live life expecting to have nothing at the end. Honestly, you could waste your whole entire life living a life to a standard that might not even exist.
I like to point out my immense hate for religious zealots. I think they are idiots. Stop trying to convert people and go get yourself a life. No religion should ever FORCE themselves on others.
Speaking of which, the one thing I hate more than religious zealots are the crazed atheists who are convinced that their rationale is right, and so therefore it disproves the existence of god. Shut up. Let people believe what they want to believe. There’s nothing more idiotic than a dumbass atheist going around trying to counter argue all the points made by religious scholars, or anyone with a certain belief. For the love of GOD, VISHNU, RA, ALLAH, or L. RON HUBBARD, NO ONE CARES. LET PEOPLE BELIEVE WHAT THEY WANT TO BELIEVE.
And not to diss on Christianity (I think everyone else did a serviceable job), which I find very interesting, but like everyone else here, there’s so many contradictions in some of the ideas;
Take for example, the gays. God created everything living and dead, and loved each of his creations dearly. He controls everything. So why did he create gays if he didn’t love them just as much? I seriously doubt god created a creature to send straight to hell. That’s idiotic. And secondly, take all the great people in the past and the present who weren’t Christian. Are you honestly proposing that they go to hell because they don’t believe in god? After all they’ve done? Nah. That’s ridiculous.
I’m very open minded, and like to look at things from both sides of the picture. If anyone wants to refute my statements, feel free. I only went to CCD for a year, so my beliefs aren’t that fleshed out. I think everyone else here pretty much said what I needed to say, except for a few tidbits which I’ll keep to myself.
And that would be about it.
I do believe that there is a hell, as well as a heaven. When I was young, I figured hell was just as it was portrayed in the movies; flames everywhere and no escape, just sadly walking around with your head down, wondering where you went wrong and kicking yourself for your mistakes. Other than that I’ve never really thought about what hell is like. I think it is a place of spiritual torture, for that is far worse than physical torture. I think it is a place of darkness, kind of like how James Joyce described it. Just you, alone with your thoughts and regrets, hating yourself for your choices. The pain you would put yourself through is more than enough punishment for the mistakes you made. I think the severity of your sinfulness determines level of physical pain applied. For a murderer or rapist, they would be condemned to the intense heat and foul-smelling odors Joyce describes. Someone who committed no treacherous sin, yet did not treat people with love or respect and cared only about themselves, would be subject only to their own punishment.
Growing up in a Christian home, I have to disagree with those who claim there is no God. My beliefs (and those of many other Christians I know) differ greatly from the Catholicism you were taught as children. First of all, everyone has free will to do as they please. So God is not picking and choosing people that he wants to go to hell when they are born by plotting out their lives. We each are our own being, capable of making our own choices. God does not send people to hell; it’s a choice that people make every day with their actions. I also completely disagree with the Catholic thought that you must be a Catholic to reach heaven. That is absurd. There are so many different beliefs and views of religion, but they all really boil down to one specific point: love. All religions are based on love, whether you are Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, Islamic, etc. Each of these religions speaks extensively of God’s love, and how we are to love others as God loves us. So really, loving others is, in a way, loving God, no matter what religion. Matt W put it best, “One of the main laws is love God. I think this is universal and if you believe there is a God, than however you worship him (or her), whether it is Catholicism or Judaism or Buddhism or Hinduism, is acceptable. And God, being an all-knowing deity, I think, would find it in his heart to forgive us if we aren’t completely correct in our beliefs.” Also, confessing your sins to a priest is pointless. Just because someone dresses in expensive robes and speaks on a stage does not give them the ability to absolve sins. In fact, they might be just as sinful (if not more) than yourself. Lastly, every person makes mistakes, so really, everyone should be sentenced to hell if it’s a place for sinners. The difference is repentance. If you know what you did was wrong and admit it, you would be forgiven. Those who are either don’t care or are too stubborn to admit their mistake are the ones that suffer.
To Janiru: I agree with you about the religious zealots, I hope I didn’t come off sounding preachy, but I just wanted to say what I believe. I’m with you about the atheists, they can be just as bad as people who try to force religion, because they sometimes try to force non-religion. Everyone has a right to believe what they want, and no one should put them down because of that.
Oh, yeah, and I’m a PACKERS fan. Just thought you should know.
Bunje: I sent you my essay at around 3, can you let me know if you got it? thanks
According to the U.S. Department of Justice records, a person is sexually assaulted every two minutes (http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/frequency-of-sexual-assault). According to an article from CBS News based on information from the World Health Organization (WHO), a person commits suicide every forty seconds, while a person is murdered every sixty seconds (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/health/main524231.shtml). Lastly, according to the National Highway Safety Traffic Administration, a person dies from a drunk driving accident every two minutes (http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/). How are we able to judge whether such action is the right thing or the wrong thing? Is it possible that we rely so heavily upon what society defines “normal” to be that we have allowed it to determine the afterlife? If hell is one of the places which awaits our presence after our last moments upon the surface of the earth, it serves as nothing more than a divisor between two different mindsets of animate beings. There are those whose lives are marked by empathy, the maintenance of close relationships, and a willingness to help anything but themselves. Then, oppositely, there are those marked by destruction and the ability to create calamitous thoughts as if it were a work of art. Heaven and hell are two separate universes which remain dissimilar only through differences in human mentality. There is a hell which exists in the afterlife, but the stereotypical images of a place with fire, starving servants, whips, the persistent smell of blood, eternal darkness, and the birthplace of thousands of diseases, does not exist. In fact, heaven and hell possess identical visages, comprising the same smell, look, feelings, and sounds. They both contain the same look with strange and unfamiliar scenes. For example, a rainy hill valley is placed upon the scene of an incandescent ocean at midnight, or snowy mountains may be placed in the midst of a savanna as winter begins to hold hands with summer. They are images which we have yet to be exposed to, and lie far beyond our treasured sense of logic. The smell which penetrates the air depends upon the scene; it could be the smell of lavender mixed with a salty ocean, home-made candy mixed with that particular scent of fall, or tree sap in the dry air of a desert. Regardless of the scene, one particular aspect of these universes comprising the deceased is the wind which flows between the fingertips of such beings as if they were all taking their first leap off the side of a tower or out of a plane thousands of feet above farm fields, cities, and bodies of water. This wind is probably the only aspect which seems at all familiar to them in such a vastly different world.
In determining what lies ahead of us once our hearts fail us, I must give partial credit to Julie Anne Peters, the author of “Define ‘Normal’”. Although I am not much of a reader, this book along with “Little Women” is the only novel I have read twice in my life. Within the pages of this book, the author reveals truths to her readers based not only upon the fact that it is impossible to define “normal”, yet, it is also impossible to define practically anything in life. From this idea, I have come to realize that since we cannot truly define what is right or wrong, we cannot define what makes a person good or bad. If we cannot define what makes a person good or bad, how could we possibly create an afterlife which depends upon such factors? Simply because the majority of people find something to be right, does not mean by any standards that it truly is. This can even be seen within the different cultures that thrive upon the earth; what one culture considers to be right, is completely opposed in another. The truth about right and wrong is being set right in front of us, which is that we have no way to measure it.
In order for one to be admitted to heaven or hell, it depends upon the way in which one views human interaction, pain, and the occurrences of mistakes. Based upon this outlook and how an individual handles certain situations will prescribe them to their destined universe. Nevertheless, mentality is one of the main deciding factors. There are people in this world who kill others for a living, yet, one does it with the intention of protecting a group of people, while the other does it out of a desire for materialistic objects and a powerful self-reputation. There are people who steal things from others, but one does it to prevent death from starvation while the other engages in such an activity usually out of mere boredom, peer pressure, or for a false sense of accomplishment. There are people who cheat, lie, disrespect others, and hurt people, but they do it for different reasons and have different mindsets.
As far as which version of hell I concur with more (Gehenna or Sheol), I agree with particular ideas about them both. As with Gehenna, I do believe that hell is the scene of a very worldly destination, but I also feel that hell is not a punishment. Therefore, I partially agree with Sheol because unlike Gehenna, the punishment involved does not seem to be as severe. I understand that the objective is to pick just one, but it would be impossible for me to decipher between what aspect I consider to be more important: the visual image or the way in which the deceased are treated.
To say that there are varying degrees of sin would be to say that there are varying degrees of mentality, which although may be true, I believe that an individual’s mentality can be grouped under one of the places in the afterlife. As a result, I do not believe that people are judged by various levels of sin in hell, nor are they punished accordingly to such sin. Instead, I believe that people cannot be punished for what the majority considers to be sinful because such sinners perceive life in a different way; a way in which we cannot judge to be right or wrong. So, we could not punish people according to a ‘level of sin’. The worst sin imaginable would be deciding to eradicate every soul from the face of the earth through a process of an injection which would basically cause teenagers to feel as if they were one hundred and thirty years old, while adults would be stuck within a body seemingly thousands of years old. They would each suffer a very slow death. By the end of each day, they would find themselves praying for death; they would covet the very thought of never waking to see another day upon the earth. While such an unthinkable act would be considered inhumane, one must also consider the fact that such creators of torture possess a different mentality. Lastly, one very specific aspect that I have yet to understand about Lutheranism, the unfortunate religion I have been baptized with, is how a loving and carefree God could possibly allow people possessing a different outlook on life to be punished through such excruciating fates. According to my religion’s outlook of God in comparison to my own feelings, he is portrayed as a ludicrous figure. How could the ‘creator’ of each one of us not realize that we are all made very differently? How could he punish someone who he himself granted a different mentality to? None of it adds up, and if I were to actually follow through with what my religion believes, I would be ludicrous as well. In no way am I trying to disrespect the faiths of other Lutherans; this is simply my opinion of a religion that I personally disagree with. Being sent to hell is not a punishment; it is just a different place for people of different perspectives to go to when they inhale their last breaths just as any one of us will do at the conclusion of our own lives. We have nothing to fear when it comes to death because it is essentially our own mentality that decides where we are to go next, not an ethereal spirit which we lack any definite information to.
In response to Molly G:
“In hell, you would have no sense. No sight, no smell, no hearing, no sense of touch, or taste. You are physically handicapped, but you still have your mental capacity. You are still able to remember the sins that you have committed.” This interpretation of what hell might be like was very interesting, and I found it to be very unique. To lose all senses is beyond belief, especially considering the fact that without your senses, you are practically not living. I really tried to imagine what it might be like, and I realized that communication, touch, and being able to understand one’s location within any area would be impossible. As you said, the only thing that the person would be left with would be thoughts, most of which would revolve around the sin they have committed. Additionally, another quote that got my attention was when you stated, “It is when you go against your morals, and you know what you did was wrong and will hurt the ones around you, either physically or mentally.” This related to my blog in a way with my whole theory of mentality being the deciding factor of one’s fate. There are plenty of sins that are committed every day, but one must keep in mind that they are committed for different reasons.
Ah, religion. Me and god have never gone well together. It probably started when I was about seven, and prayed for a vhs box set of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles cartoon vhs box set. I realize I was really about a generation too late to be asking for this, but I wanted it more than anything that night, and promised never, ever to ask for anything else. My entire life I would be satisfied knowing I had VHS tapes of those wacky kung fu turtles. Needless to say, I was traumatized when I went downstairs from my room the next morning and there were no turtle tapes to be found. From that point on, I became staunchly opposed to religion. To this day, I remain turtleless.
In all seriousness, however, no. I do not believe in hell in any form, or any afterlife for that matter. I don't believe in reincarnation, and I don't believe in the human soul. I believe it would make sense to reuse my favorite quote from House here. "I choose to believe that the white light people sometimes see- they're all just chemical reactions that take place when the brain shuts down. There's no conclusive science. My choice has no practical relevance to my life, I choose the outcome I find more comforting. I find it more comforting to believe that this isn't simply a test."
I don't believe I was taught this belief, though. I came to it on my own. The only family members I saw as a child more than once or twice a year were my parents and grandmother. My grandmother is a fairly religious woman for a C&E Christian. If I was sleeping at her house, she would tell me to be sure to say my prayers before hacking away at my frail body with a fire axe.
Wait. No. I think I messed up here. Let me try that again.
If I was sleeping at her house, she would tell me to be sure to say my prayers before I went to bed. I did, but I didn't really understand why. The bible seemed like an interesting series of stories to me, but not unless there were pictures involved. I found Disney's Hercules more believable. (And for a period of time, I came to the conclusion that God and Zeus both existed as equals up in heaven. Nobody ever did anything to stop me from thinking this.) My parents were both agnostic, and did their best to let me believe whatever I wanted to. Eventually, after researching several religion I came to the logical conclusion that none of them make sense, and that either they're all sort of right, or they're all dead wrong. In any case, I have no need to believe in any of them.
As for the realism of the two hells, obviously I find the real one more realistic. Of course, this really just fuels my religious criticism. The people writing the bible having to use familiar places rather than describe something told to them by god seems a bit fishy.
Once again, I don't believe in god, therefore I don't believe in sin. There are traceable roots for every religious sin, some of which stem from works after the bible itself. The sins that are truly punishable are done so adequately by our court system. Though if I were to say what I believe is the worst “sin” imaginable, it would be to hurt another human in the name of god. To cause pain to another based only on your own unfounded beliefs is unforgivable.
Finally, the idea of a hell going along with a truly omnipotent god makes no sense whatsoever. However, I can let slide the idea that a powerful, but not all-powerful, god may be unable to keep souls from falling into the hands of a similarly powerful, evil, god.
To Matt C:
You are the man. I'm glad to see someone else believes so strongly in the falsehood of religion. I'm definitely saving that poem you put up. The belief in god has hurt far too many to make up for those it helps. Any who disagree with me need look no farther than the Spanish Inquisition.
http://www.geocities.com/christprise/holy-inquisitions-2.html
Yeah. Weren't expecting that, were you?
oh wow. some of the things i was reading here are....i don't know how to say it but, but I was shocked and disappointed in some of the things people had to say about it....I actually got angry at some of the responses but I guess that's the point of this blog, so we can see other peoples views on this.I need some time to calm down before i continue working on my blog..after reading a couple i had to stop myself because the more i read....
To Jani aka Ox:
"I don’t necessarily think it would smell bad, but smell like…. fire, which I think smells pretty nice. And due to the insurmountable amount of flames, I would assume it to be very muggy and humid. And I also like to think Satan isn’t actually that bad of a guy, but was misunderstood."
I love love love love the smell of fire and gas from the gas station. It's interesting that you pointed out Satan is misunderstood because I never thought about Satan as a person who has feelings. Satan is like the bad boy that every girl wants to taste. Sin is appealing in a number of ways because its tempting to do out of the norm situations. If there is a Satan, he could be a regular guy who is King of a Wasteland full of bodies and flames. What's not normal about that?
For the record I would like to state like a few of my classmates before me that I did the CCD once a week, and earned my right to be called a catholic, but this is no way means that I am fully convinced.
I believe in a Heaven and a Hell. Through years and years of it being embedded in my mind one of the things I believe in is that there is a place where you go when you die. One of my CCD teacher actually told me that he didn’t believe Hell to be a place of eternal damnation, yet a place of reflection and all that hoopla about the fires of Hell and it being a terrible place where everything burns is similar to a hallmark holiday, something made up for a greater affect. After hearing this I immediately agreed. I think Hell is the places of your past, where all the things that really stand out and that you should be truly ashamed of haunt you, until you realize your wrongdoing and feel remorse. There are no fiery walls, nor is it anything like that described in the excerpt we read about Hell. I feel it is more of a place to reflect, and to do your penance. I haven’t been to church since three Christmases ago, and I am stuck in that stage of knowing a religion, but not being sure of it. Yet, I still feel like what I learned was a foundation that I will expand on. This teacher that really talked to us candidly, saying more than what a CCD teacher probably should, really made me convinced that Hell might not be the terrible, scary place that it’s made out to be. My parents never really talked about religion, since my dad isn’t that religious at all. My mom does the church thing, less and less every year it seems like. I’m actually happy that they made me sit through CCD, because in the end I now have these values and was exposed to something different. I don’t believe that being catholic is a bad thing, or that it is all about forcing you to believe something although it basically is.
The spiritual destination seems much more realistic to me, because I am a logic person. I like to see things before I believe them. If there was a worldly destination I think there would be more evidence, thus I can’t give that the benefit of the doubt. The spiritual would have less evidence to support it, but would be easily confirmed in death, and since no one has survived death it is still a possibility. I will not be convinced fully until I die and see for myself, but since I hate to think about death this is a topic that I haven’t reflected on prior to this question.
I have to disagree with Dante, because I think that a sin is a sin no matter how different it is. A sin that would send you to Hell in the first place to me would be extreme enough that there wouldn’t need to be levels. It all matter upon the soul whether or not they get out of Hell. People who have no soul, and no heart will rot in Hell forever and never see the error of their ways while those who have a soul somewhere deep inside of them will eventually see the error of their ways and be guided up to Purgatory. I think Hitler and Stalin are in the same place just Hitler might get out earlier according to Dan’s thought process. I feel as if a sin is a sin, though a big enough sin that will land you in Hell for me would have to be murder, stealing, or anything along those lines. Basically things that are VERY wrong morally.
I honestly don’t know what I feel about God himself. It almost comforts me to think of him as an all knowing power that is full of love and compassion. I think that people’s actions themselves get them to Hell, not God’s words. I think God put out a moral compass and when you step on that scale of morality that all of your crimes of great degree come out and are weighed. God put out a moral standard and it is up to us to follow and abide by it. We can fully choose not to abide by it, but come judgment day the acts we have committed will speak for themselves. God doesn’t need to keep us in check, nor govern our every move. He just watches over and keeps us heading in what is generally accepted as the right path. I honestly don’t think his words are what damns us, but more of the moral compass of humanity.
Toni-
If I believe God was real, I’d think he is just acting as a parent. For instance if I had a child who kept stealing even after I tried correcting them, I’d make their life miserable and punish them the best way I know how whether that is lecturing or reporting them to authority. God is suppose to be forgiving, love, and caring like any parent, but if the child acts out, God is right there to take action in his own hands to discipline.
I was completely bewildered by your blog. This quote above is so well said, it really to me is what God is like. Although I disagreed with your blog at points I think that your blog honestly impacted me the most. I love looking at all facts of religion and the story about your friend who was hypnotized was very intriguing. I would actually love to do that just once, just to experience it. I think it would be an interesting experience I like to keep my options open, and don’t like tying myself down to just being Catholic. I think life is built up of little experiences that we learn and grow from, and we get our views from everything we encounter, and to really make the best decisions for ourselves we must take in all life has to offer no matter if we agree with it or not.
Growing up I believed in heaven and hell as if they were real places. When I was able to think for myself and not be heavily influenced by the people around me, I started to believe that hell in fact does not exist. It would be truly scary to think that a higher force is watching our every move waiting for us to screw up so we could soon die and be pushed into a fiery hell where are souls are trapped there forever due to our sins, but really how is that even practical? I’ve never been the one that believed in religion. I wish I did because I feel I’d be less cynical if I could somehow communicate and be loved by an always forgiven person [God]. As I got older, I started to develop the view that all religions are like legends. Legends like big foot and goat man were never popular enough to really influence anyone, but religion as a legend benefited people for the greater good because it gives people someone to turn to in time of need when we feel a lone and helpless. In fact, believing in someone to believe in ourselves helps us regain the confidence and the stability to help ourselves as said in the quote “God helps those who helps themselves”. The idea just seems oh so very psychological.
My mom always threatened if I lied the devil would come through the floors and grab my ankles and pull me down under. Therefore, I was deathly afraid to lie to her. I was never baptized and I never had a religion pushed onto me before. My beliefs were influenced from my parents a bit. My step dad is a reincarnation believer, which I am also. I believe that people have had past lives and in order for people to have past lives reincarnation needs to take place. It seems like a more logical explanation to those who have reoccurrences in their life that seem to have happened before. Over the summer I discussed this a lot with my friend Alby. His grandmother hypnotized him and he became aware that he was a German soldier in his past through the images that he had seen. It seems farfetched but very interesting to say the least. Friends like him definitely impacted my beliefs. Therefore, I don’t think there is a hell and the point of it is only to scare people in to actually having morals rather than committing actions that are “sinful”.
Oddly the worldly destination seems more realistic. At one point, weren’t all criminals shipped to Australia to live? The description of the destination forces me to imagine a place where everyone is cremated when death approaches, therefore fire is always lit because people die every minute.
Since I don’t believe in a hell, I really don’t think hell is like a building in New York that has various levels. A sin should be a sin, severity of the sin should not be a factor with what sinful level you reach. If there are different hells then that indicates several different environments that hell encompasses. If there is a hell, I think hell is one place with many people who committed various crimes just like a prison. There is no ultimate sin.
If I believed God was real, I’d think he is just acting as a parent. For instance if I had a child who kept stealing even after I tried correcting them, I’d make their life miserable and punish them the best way I know how whether that is lecturing or reporting them to authority. God is suppose to be forgiving, loving, and caring like any parent, but if the child acts out, God is right there to take action in his own hands to discipline. There is nothing to reconcile. God’s character is like anyone else’s.
In response to Janiru's comment:
"Take for example, the gays. God created everything living and dead, and loved each of his creations dearly. He controls everything. So why did he create gays if he didn’t love them just as much? I seriously doubt god created a creature to send straight to hell. That’s idiotic. And secondly, take all the great people in the past and the present who weren’t Christian. Are you honestly proposing that they go to hell because they don’t believe in god? After all they’ve done? Nah. That’s ridiculous."
This is exactly the point I was trying to make, but my words were just a convoluted mess. God supposedly creates everyone and everything, so for him to create gays, atheists, Gandhi, terrorists, etc, just to send straight to hell.. well that idea is ridiculous. Why should people be sent to hell, with endless suffering and torture, just because they don't commend the word of God. If anything, I'd compare God to Hitler (extreme, I know), in the sense that Hitler wanted a perfect race-- no one other than German, or "Aryan". Those who did not fit this description or descent were sent to concentration camps, murdered by the thousands. Now, this supposed God only allows those who believe in him, accept and follow his beliefs and teachings, and commit no mortal sins into his Heaven. All the others he sends to Hell to be forever tortured, killed over and over and over again. hm...
Leonor, I just combined all the things I hate and fear most, and that's my hell. So NATURALLY country music is included, the singers of which I have long suspected of being satan spawn. Especially Jessica Simpson.
Danny, hurray for shopping cart religions! I too have taken heaven, hell, and reincarnation and combined it to make one tasty religious burrito.
Myra, why a bunny suit?
Jani, wasn't there a quote from South Park that went, "And if I'm bicurious, and I'm somehow from God, well, then God must be a little bicurious himself."
Also the Satan thing goes with the "beelz" lyrics I posted.
erik n, ditto on the whole religion based on love and the Catholic vs. other sects.
Also, zealots of all kinds (religious and atheist) scare the hell out of me (pun once again intended).
To all of you who question why God would creat people just to send them to hell:
READ THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He didn't. End of story! However the people who were paid to transcribe the Bible made it seem that way. As I meantioned in my blog, the bible was used more as a tool for control than as way to edify the people. IT was written in order for empires to gain power. it accomplished this by make the people conform to a strict set of standards i.e being catholic and not gay, etc.
If you failed to meet these criteria would were doomed for Hell, or so the leaders said. Now why would people listen? BEucase back then people still ruled by divine birthright. So, in all, God never said that he would smite gays or non-Chirstians no good, dirty lying trickers did who were paid to word the Bible that way.
The whole gay thing isn't really about being gay either. it is about polygamy, which is a mortal sin. In the olden times there was a city, i forget the name, that was full of homsexuals. the were highly permiscuous and didn't have monogamous relationships. that is why the bible denies gays and damns them to hell. however, recently, it has been decided that the bible is condemning the act, not the people. So a monagomous gay is perfectly fine, by the same token though a polygamous hetrosexual is not. Understand?
HOpe this claries some doubts. hit me up for anymore doubts you may have. i explain them away. :)
Hell exists. God exists. Heaven exists. I have never in my life doubted that hell was nonexistent. I’ve always known what it was and what its purpose was. Hell is described in the bible, and I never question anything written in the bible.
I have a pretty clear picture of what hell looks like from its description in the bible. I also saw a scene from a movie one time called “Akira Kurosawa’s Dreams” directed by Akira Kurosawa himself in Japanese. There was a scene in the movie that was done so well that you would think Kurosawa went to hell just to film that scene. There were horned souls moaning in pain and rolling on the ground. The place itself was like a dry isolated desert area, and naturally, there was a pool of fire. Needless to say, after seeing that scene, I had a good clear view of hell. Hell must smell of burning bodies and our noses can’t imagine the horrible stench that probably dominates hell. It is hot, tormenting, and the pain and suffering is endless.
My belief came from my religion, my church and my family. I was raised an Orthodox Christian and have abide by its rules all my life. I am a strong believer, go to church every Sunday, and I go by the Orthodox calendar; celebrating Christmas on January the 7th and New Years on January the 14th. (I also celebrate it when everybody else does, so I get to celebrate each one twice.) Our faith tells us that there is a hell, and if we do not follow the commandments, that’s where we’ll end up. I believe it completely.
Getting to hell is not hard. Little things that you fail to confess to a priest can land you in hell. Even small things such as having an excessive attachment to items, clothing, parents and friends, forgetting to pray, and failing to keep the fast. Little things that you usually overlook and don’t notice, add up. That is how our religion sees it, since other beliefs are not as strict as ours, the examples may differ.
Hell is a spiritual destination. I do not believe that some will be resurrected to "everlasting life," because once you end up in hell, that’s it; there’s no way out.
I do believe that there are varying degrees of sin and that each one is punishable in its own way. The worst sin I could imagine is murder. When you kill somebody that is like you saying to God, “I didn’t like the way you made that person. You made a mistake, and I’m going to kill him so I could correct that mistake for you.” So yeah, killing another person is definitely the worst, but denying God is also one of the worst things a person could do. God created us, forgives us consistently, is always there for us, so not acknowledging his existence is a slap in the face. These two sins should be dealt with the worst possible way in hell. I guess torture and more torture should do the job.
The last question, I found insulting and bewildering. I would never think to doubt God, because he knows what he is doing, and who am I to judge? Certain people deserve to descend into hell, and it would be unfair for God not to punish people who live a certain lifestyle. Hell is a punishment because people deserve it; people need something to pay for their actions in the end. It is not by God’s word, but people’s actions that people descend into hell.
I think people try to gain understanding of religion by putting logic into it, but it should not be messed with. There is an explanation to everything, but it is way beyond human comprehension, and should not be probed and pulled apart.
matty w:
"In the olden times there was a city, i forget the name, that was full of homsexuals."
I think you're referring to Sodom and Gomorrah. They were destroyed by God himself because homosexuality had spread, as well as many other sins in that area.
By the by, matt, the name of the city you're looking for is Sodom, destroyed by fire and brimstone and all that jazz. It's also where we get the word 'sodomy', and where I go to for my example of the old/new testament incongruence.
Dangit. Tamari beat me to the punch.
Does anyone but me find it extremely interesting that a large number of religions all follow the same basic beliefs and have the same stories (Like the whole flood story, and creation story)?
This only furthers my shopping cart religion, because, when you get down to the bare bones of them, tons of religions are pretty much the same. Hence my propensity to blur the lines between religions, and throw them together like a cookie with heart shaped chocolate chips (what is with my weird food analogies tonight?).
Also, I would like to say that I find the idea that the world was created by some supreme force just as plausible as The Big Bang Theory, a.k.a. one day some stuff slammed into each other and eventually life formed from pretty much nowhere. Maybe this is just my hate for the subject of science, but I don't really think thats it.
Honestly, I would be thrilled if someone argued with me about this. I would love to hear other's reasoning and feel less like I'm just talking to myself.
Tamari
Thanks you for the correct and name. I couldn't remember. Also, i agree, we shouldn't try to logic our way through God. There is probably an answer but we definetly can't even begin to comprehend it. So kudos and it is nice to know someone feels the same way as me.
To Dan:
Next time be faster :)
Earth to Ashley, Brendan, Jani, and anyone else in my German class: did anybody find "trosten" on the homework?
To Sarah, I withhold all comments on the Big Bang (giggity) Theory until the LHC actually starts colliding things and decides if that's what really happened. Plus, if the Higgs Boson (God Particle) is actually found, we may need to have this blog again.
Sometimes it’s hard for me to imagine that there is anything to experience after death. I’m skeptical about the destinations of our “souls” once we stop breathing and our bodies fail us. I have a hard time being able to grasp the concept of hell and heaven, but I hope that they do exist. I can’t bear to think that there is nothing left after we die. I often wonder if we can feel death after it occurs. Maybe our bodies are unresponsive and seem “dead,” but what if we are still aware and can feel the pain caused by death even after our life lines run flat? I feel that this may be what hell consists of. There may be some place deep within the earth that is full of pain and suffering for all eternity. I tend to lean towards the idea that the pain we feel during our death does not cease once we die. In hell, our pain is magnified infinitely and there is no escape. There is no break from the fiery fury of hell at any time. I think that hell must be the most scary, intimidating place ever imaginable. The feeling of sheer terror and adrenaline are always at an all-time high within a spirit stuck in hell. The misery and unbearably must compare to when a person is driven to their final ends and feel they can go on no longer. Except unlike here on earth, there is no finish line to push for. The end of the race is the end of eternity. The smell of hell must be a combination of the most putrid and foul smells producible. Rotting piles of things line the streets of hell along with depressed souls hovering around with each other in vain hopes of feeling better in each other’s company. Hell is the nastiest, most terrible, evil and immoral place conceivable.
My beliefs come in part from my nine or so years at CCD and from my compilation of visuals from Hollywood. At CCD, we learned about heaven and hell and the things we should do to prevent eternal damnation as well as the things we should do to ensure our place in heaven. To me, it always seemed like the things that would send us to hell were very extreme. I feel that only capital sins are the ones that will send us straight to hell. I believe that killing another person and having no remorse is the one major ticket to hell. Any other really horrible crime could send a person to hell as well as long as the person shows no sign of being sorry for what they have done. Remorse is key.
It would make sense that there are different layers of hell that you can go to depending on the severity of your crimes on earth. The worst level would be the center of the earth and the hottest, most terrible part of it. This would be what I described earlier as hell. The other less severe levels of hell would correspond to the petty, less harsh sins a person commits on earth. There would still be pain involved in these places, but not so much as the center of the earth. There may even be a possibility to redemption and entry to heaven. This would probably take a long time to get approved by God, but the less time in hell the better since you would be staying for all eternity. Murder would have to be the worst sin. Taking another life and playing the roll of God by doing so just seems like the only thing a person can do on earth to make their place in hell permanent.
I believe that God gives us a whole lifetime to do good and ensure ourselves a place in heaven. There is no such thing as a sinless, perfect person, but everyone is able to reconcile their sins. Eight or ninety long years to decide that God is your savior is plenty of time to get the partying out of your system and realize the importance in believing in him. Therefore, God is being plenty fair. He doesn’t condemn you as soon as you do something bad. He pardons you if you truly wish for forgiveness. I am not the most religious person in the world by any means, but looking at things like the fascinating flawlessly functioning human body, the intricacy of flowers, and the sun in the sky tell me that there has to be some higher being that created everything to work together perfectly. It cant possibly have all happened by chance.
matty w;
after reading your comment where you said "it is nice to know someone feels the same way as me," I had to go back and find your blog and read it.
And i must say, i was impressed by it. Your blog was one of the only few I actually liked this week. I admire the way you answered the last question. Your last paragraph was amazing, I couldn't have said it better, i was agreeing with everything as i was reading it:)
Earth to Sarah: Nope
Do hell and heaven exist? Is one of the most debated topics there are. I believe like many that hell and heaven exist. I don’t believe that because of my parents, friends or anyone else. I have just always believed that there is a place where all the “bad” people after they are dead. The existence of hell and heaven are my personal beliefs.
Hell would be the most foulest place to ever exist. It would be burning hot at all times. There would be fire spread everywhere. Flames that would be impossible to conquer. No one will ever be able to get until they don’t admit not just by words by their heart (Hitler doesn’t have one so he will never be able to get out) that they were wrong and they should get a second chance to perfect it. Once that happens then the person would be sent back as a beetle or something disgusting like that to repent their sins.
I don’t just believe that there is one hell, like Sarah Crane I believe that there are personalized hells. The worse the sin would have been, the worse the punishment would be. For serial killers their punishment would be the most horrid torturous thing that anyone could think of. To think of punishments someone should send Jigsaw down there. He would torture those people in the most morbid way there ever could be.
Everyone has different opinions about what the worst sin on earth would be. I think that it’s trying to hurt others. Most just emotionally or physically but something that would effect many people. For example: before doctors can start practicing medicine they must take a vow to help all people. If a doctor takes that vow but doesn’t help, that’s not as bad as keeping a patient alive and doing multiple surgeries only to get money out of them. And some doctors have the nerve to keep a dead patient in the hospital and tell their family members that they need to surgery and they have to pay for it. People that go to hell, because sins like these are the worst sins. People like this would have to repent what they did for eternity. Making a couple of small mistakes is acceptable but making a major mistake is unforgivable. Like Hitler will never be able to some back to earth these type of people won’t be able to either. Sins like these should be dealt with morbid consequences. Hell should be the torturous place where the person would get tortured in a different way everyday. Each and everyday the torture treatment should change, but it should be twice the pain that the victim and the victims loved ones felt. Once the person knows that they have done something wrong and they are changed persona at heart then they should be let back on earth as a cockroach that will die eventually. They should have to start low and work their way up.
Its hard to think of god as a perfect because he punishes people and yet he treats some like kings. But he only does it out of fairness. “What you reap is what you sow” and god simply only follows that reasoning. God made have created earth in some people’s eyes but he did not tell people how to act. He didn’t plan for someone to kill another or to help another. He just simply created the earth people are always responsible for their own actions.
My beliefs have been developed mainly through my parents and my church. I am a frequent Catholic Church attendee and yes, I have already gone through the process of confirmation in which I declared my faith to the Lord. However, I have never felt that connected with my faith. I attend church every Sunday because my parents make me and they are somewhat really religious. (You can tell by the various religious paraphernalia around my house, not to mention a huge Virgin Mary in front of the house). But I find myself questioning my faith all the time. Especially during church when I look around at all the people gathered together praying to this one God- a god that they cant know for certain exists. So, I don’t consider myself very religious and when I grow older I may reject the faith completely. But for now, I do believe in God. And I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. However, I view God differently and I don’t believe everything the Catholic faith teaches. But God can be a source of hope. It’s nice to think that someone is watching over you. And as for the bad things that happen in the world, well they obstacles that God present to us in order for us to overcome. In order to instill courage in us, he will present us with a circumstance in which courage is needed. In order to show strength, he will present a circumstance in which our strength is needed.
Hell? I don’t know if I believe that one exists. I certainly believe that a Heaven exists, but I never really thought about Hell. If hell exists, it is definitely a spiritual place rather than a destination. I have always been taught that Hell is where sinners are tortured. They are the souls that have not repented their sins by the time of their death and God sent them to forever spend their life in damnation. I refuse to believe this is true. I’ve heard the stories and I’ve seen the pictures, but I don’t believe that God would send his children to spend eternity suffering. I love Devon’s interpretation of Hell. I have never thought of hell as a place of reflection. I want to believe that hell is not filled with fire and darkness. I want to know that everyone has a chance.
So for my interpretation of hell, I am hopeful that God will do what is right because I don’t think that sinners should go unpunished. The worst sin that I can possibly think of is murder because it is taken a life away that God created. Though I know there are circumstances in which it may be necessary, for instance in self-defense, God will know this and he will be able to make his judgment.
A part of me seems completely naïve for saying and believing in any of this. After all, when you die, you die. Nothing happens. Right? And if God is able to make the judgments on our lives, how do we have any control? See, I am always skeptical to my religion because I don’t know if I believe in my faith more or if I believe in just common logic.
Janiru:
"Take for example, the gays. God created everything living and dead, and loved each of his creations dearly. He controls everything. So why did he create gays if he didn’t love them just as much?I seriously doubt god created a creature to send straight to hell."
Why not? God created creatures to send straight to heaven; the mentally challenged.
and as crazy as i might sound, i will admit that i do not think God created Gays. i do not think being gay is hereditary, it is a choice people make, especially now more than ever since it seems to be in "style."
Sarah: I completely agree with on that once people repent their sins and are ready to believe that they were wrong, then they should have to work their way back to being a human. By which time they should a completely reformed person.
“One of the main laws is love God. I think this is universal and if you believe there is a God, than however you worship him (or her), whether it is Catholicism or Judaism or Buddhism or Hinduism, is acceptable. And God, being an all-knowing deity, I think, would find it in his heart to forgive us if we aren’t completely correct in our beliefs.”
Matt W-
I was surprised to see how many people were once involved in organized religion but because of the strict attitudes of the church turned away in confusions and disgust. I guess that I am part of this group (although, my worry of God smiting me for even saying this tells me that deep inside I do still believe in him for some reason or another). I believe what you said about how the Bible as a source to turn to for morals is dead on. The people who take things too literally from the Bible are the people who shove religion down our throat and turn us away from everything having to do with God. The crazy people on Wife Swap and shows like that really disgust me and make me want to seriously give them a smack out of their craziness. The Bible was never meant for literal interpretation. When you say this about how love of God will give you entry to heaven is what I believe in completely. We talked about this in gym actually, but it made me think about all the good people in the world who have done so much good but by catholic and Christian standards would not be given permission into heaven. This just can’t be true. How do we know which religion is truly the right one? We don’t. We never will. If everyone thinks they are right in their religion they practice, how can god blame and punish those who thought they were living their lives the right way? God has to have a little more mercy for the homosexuals and Jews.
I believe that hell exists, but my version of hell is atypical from the usual burning-flesh-river-of-dead-souls-hell. I don’t think hell is really a fire pit. When I think of hell, I see a purgatory blank space of nothing. To me, an eternity of nothing, no human contact, no sounds, smells, or feelings, is worse than the fire version of hell. To remain in the human form, but not experience any sort of life, is torture in itself.
I have never committed a mortal sin, so ending up in hell has never been a big fear. My religion, I am a Lutheran, has had an impact on this idea. My religion, compared to most religions, is very open. It puts little to no social or moral restrictions on its members. There are no rules for diet or dress, and I have never been told that if I sinned, I will go to hell or that God will strike me down. In Sunday school the Ten Commandments was brought up, but that was the only time I can remember discussing any sort of rules in church.
How someone ends up in my version of hell is no different from the typical hell. Petty liars will not end up in hell, nor will those who committed minor sins. However, those who murder, steal, wreck havoc, etc will end up in hell.
The worst sin I can imagine would be to harm a child. Not only are they defenseless physically, but they are emotionally as well. Children are naively trusting of adults. If you tell a child the world is flat, or that dinosaurs still roam the earth, they will take your word for it. This trait of unquestionable trust disappears as children grow into adults. If a parent tries to explain something to their teen, the teen will shrug off the wisdom; but several years earlier, when the teen was a child, they would have lapped up any information handed to them. By point is that to take advantage of the confidence children gladly entrust in us, is the greatest sin of all.
God is all-powerful. Sending people to hell does not seem out of character. Read a few excerpts from the bible, and it’s clear that God isn’t always merciless. God banished Adam and Eve from the utopian Garden of Eden. When he was upset that his creations became to rambunctious, he flooded the entire Earth, killing everyone. He sent plague, drought, boils, toads, and the death of all first-born sons, to the Egyptians. When Jonas tried to hide from God, God sent a whale to swallow him whole. What about Jesus? He was Gods only son, and God allowed him to be sacrificed. It can be difficult to think of God as loving and caring when something unlucky or bad happens. Nevertheless, when something good, like a miracle, occurs I cannot help but believe that God is compassionate and kind.
Ashley s—
I was surprised by the statistics that you gave. Especially the one about people committing suicide every forty seconds. I agree with you on the fact that it’s almost impossible to pick between Sheol and Gehenna. They are both realistic in a sense. Gehenna is the physical version of hell and Sheol is the emotional. Sheol, though, seems like purgatory and Gehenna is more of a definite hell. When I think of Sheol I think about those cartoons were it shows people waiting at the gates of heaven, and there’s an angel who checks a list to see if a person belongs in heaven or hell.
Is there a hell? A place where the damned suffer for eternity? A place where those who have fallen from God gather? The thought of the pain; The thought of the others being tormented; The thought of the sins that one could commit, may have been the very reason society is structured as it is today. Yet, saying it exists for sure, is a bit hard to say. Though I am open to the abysmally (no pun intended) small chance of its existence, there is no reason for me to worry about it. There are countless possibilities, spread throughout the world. Why worry about some horrible place that may not truly exist. My actions are not guided by something silly such as Pascal’s Wager. I may as well run into battle with a battleaxe, and hope that I end up in Asgard.
Why do I think this way? It isn’t because of my family, who as atheists never mentioned religion at all, and by never mention, I mean at all. I remember even as a kid, when asked about my religion by some of my peers, I had ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA. It was years after I stumbled upon the wonders of the internet. After much mental scarring from other… dubious places, I settled at a site that had a relatively intelligent base of regular users. Though there were idiots at times, the ones who gave the most compelling argument won me over. I, a man of science, could not agree more. Later on, Costal’s class made me more open to the possibilities, yet I still kept the basics of my belief. I ended up as the guy that loves to poke at the fallacies of arguments of both believers and non-believers. It’s actually quite fun.
The spiritual thought of hell is more realistic. A physical place where one burns just isn’t possible. The body eventually dies off, and so will the physical pain that comes with it. There is no doubt in that. Yet, science has never truly explained the spiritual. A place beyond our own, another dimension, a place where only our most basic emotions exist, is the only possible hell that exists. Though still bordering fantasyland, this is the only possibility.
Ah…Dante’s Inferno, one of the many pieces of writing I have never gotten around to reading. Are there different levels of sin? The answer is yes and no. In reality, a sin would a sin. They go against the laws of god no matter what. Though they may not end up tossing a person deep into the deepest pits of hell, which in Dante’s writing, which strangely enough, involves being frozen. Thus, I would agree that people such as Hitler, and as Dan says, the more evil man, Stalin, would end up in one of the deepest pits of hell. The sin of killing a person is not enough to push someone into such a hole, but slaughtering countless people does. Perhaps this is true. If so, I’ll be waiting at Mt. Purgatory.
Would god be benevolent and loving? Nope. Would he be malicious? No. If he exists, he would be the guy standing off in the distance laughing as we kill each other. He wouldn’t interfere. Hell is merely the absence of God. Those who chose willingly to go against his commandments countless times would reach hell. The hell that I view possible is a near mirror of that in the Divine Comedy. The idea of Purgatory is present. Though there is still punishment, those who have done well, but have not completely followed God, are still eventually allowed into Heaven. It is doubtful that a perfect God would damn those who are merely ignorant.
Then again, hell is just a tool used by religion to force people to conform. They say “Do this” or get damned by god. Just a way to keep order. There’s no point in worrying. At religion’s the chance of hell being as horrible as described is just as small as its own existence. After all, the Catholic Church screwed with even the Seven Deadly Sins. Now, if you don’t mind me, I’ll be finding my battleaxe.
Summary: Ivan knows too much about writing he has never read.
When I was still a child my parents felt it was their duty as good parents to take me to church every weekend. Well as I grew older I grew out of all the hype about god and Jesus. The way I thought about it was I thought of everything I knew about Santa Claus. I then thought about the story of Jesus and applied the same logic and realized that organized religion is petty. After I grew out of the whole Jesus Christ hoax I started thinking about how we did in fact get to where we are as humans. Why are we here and where are we going? I realized I don’t know, I probably never will, and don’t want to. I do believe in a superior being and I believe in life after death but that’s about all.
The way I like to think about it is that I see god, or whatever you want to call him, as a magician. We are all part of one big magic trick. When you go see a magician does he tell you how he did it? Does he tell you why? No. He does it for the purpose of impressing others and mystifying them. I feel as though trying to know what happens after death should be a surprise. On top of this I have another major gripe about Jesus. If tomorrow a man claimed to be the son of god, not a single logical person would believe them. Why should they? If this were to happen everyone would shrug it off saying he was crazy. The way I see it, Jesus was the original bum who was bat-shit-crazy, wandering the earth bumming food off of people. The only difference is that the people who lived in that day and age were naïve.
It is hard to say what the consequences for sins are considering I do not believe in hell per say. However the worst sin in my opinion would be greed. People who are greedy to end make me furious to no end. I like to believe that greedy people go to the worst place possible after death. In regards to “god” being the embodiment of love I have to disagree. God is anything but magnanimous. He is supposedly the creator of all good, yet he damns people to hell. How is the superior being, the giver of life, also the being who decides who gets to be tortured for all of eternity? In my opinion god is the epitome of irony.
Ash, thanks at least for answering.
Also, for those who hold with the fire-and-brimstone hell, let me just say that not everyone hates or fears fire. Some people even like that (cough, cough, earth to my pyromaniac friends out there. YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE. A traditional hell would be like chocolate to these people. Therefore, not really hellish.
I've been going to church and studying the word of God for my entire life, so yes, I believe in Hell. No, I do not know what Hell looks like, feels like, or smells like. There are no specific descriptions of Hell in the Bible that go into detail, so I can only assume what Hell is physically like. First of all, Hell is a place without God. That is a shivering thought in itself. If there is no light of God, then there is no hope, no happiness, no love, no butterflies, no angels, no blue skies, no plant life, no anything. I think Hell is completely empty and barren, leaving the tortured sinner alone, wallowing in hate and without hope. An eternal fire burns at their body, never ceasing, but impossibly fatal. Just burning without warmth. Burning forever and ever, until Judgment Day. I just got a shiver down my spine. In order to get a one-way ticket to Hell, it is simple-- do not fear God, and do not repent. God's number one rule is to "fear God and keep His commandments." I'm not sure what scripture that is exactly, but I do know that is the scripture because I hear it in church and my mom says it frequently. And, it's simple to get rid of your sins- repent of them. Pray and ask God for forgiveness, and He WILL forgive you. Thanks to Jesus Christ, all of our sins were paid for at the cross. All we have to do, like I said before, is repent.
Obviously, I formed this opinion from my religion's beliefs (Pentecostal). I like my religion because, unlike the oppressing YOU-MUST-LEARN-RELIGION-THIS-WAY-AND-ACT-BY THESE-RULES Catholics, Pentecostal was founding on protesting this concept (Martin Luther!) and the individual relationship with God, rather than the importance of laws and rules that aren't even in the Bible. The Bible never said that there had to be a Pope. Man manipulated this religion, which resulted in corruption and war. That's where the Crusades came from, if you were wondering. People using religion as an excuse to expand their land. Sound familiar? Middle East much?
Anyway, I think that Hell is more spiritual than worldly. I agree with what Devon said... about the different levels of Hell. It depends on the sin.
There's a difference in doing wrong and not realizing it, and knowing wrong, and doing it anyway. So, I don't think that people who were never exposed to teachings of God go to Hell. God loves everyone who fears and loves Him. He loves the people that are sent to Hell, but they have to pay for their sins. It's like punishing your child. You still love him/her after they knowingly did something wrong. You have to earn your way to Heaven; it isn't an easy road to be a believer, but the rewards are obviously greater and more phenomenal than I can ever imagine.
In response to Matt c-
I couldn't disagree with you more. God loves everyone. Heaven and everlasting life is something you have to work for. Hell teaches people the concept of fear in God. If there wasn't a belief in something Holy, in something good, what is life? What's the point in not believing when there is always a choice of faith? Or hope that there's something to look forward to, hope that there's something better than this life? Like Devon said, I believe just because I do. I don't need a literal or scientific explanation for faith. That's missing the entire point.
well i'm glad people finally commented on my blog! it looks like i'll need hurtful comments, cincal remarks and plenty of expletives to catch the attention of people here.
if god loves everyone, why would he send them to hell?
There's a disappointingly low amount of "hell-raising" in this blog.
How...ironic...
...and then the moment I post about it, something interesting happens.
hilary is just mad because i don't want to be her best friend.
God doesn't send anyone to hell. People send themselves to hell.
If you're warned not to put your hand on a burning stove, and you do it anyway and you get burned, whose fault is it?
yours, or the person who said it would happen...?
To Hils:
Right on. I complete;y agree
To MattC:
To really find it funny or nessecary to hurt other people in order to gave attention. Don't say that's not what you said becuase it 100% is, now if it is not what you meant ok, but if it is...you are completely callow, heartless, and need to reassess you values because that is truly the worst kin of bully. So, you let me know what the answer is.
And Ivan:
Why do want "hell-raising"? Wy do you people enjoy consternation? Do you find it entertaining when people "blow up"? If so, which I am completely sure is correct this just proves my point that people truly are animals deep down. I could understand a civil arguement or calm diagreement but why must there be "hell-raising"? that's all.
Before I begin, I think it’s necessary for me to first express my views on religion in general
I was raised, and still am, a C&E Catholic. I’ve been baptized, communed, and confirmed by the Catholic church, so I’m at least recognized as a person in their eyes. I went to CCD every Sunday for nine years and received an amount of information equivalent to what I learn in one week in real school. I have a distant relationship with God, but it is my religious background that has given me my views on religion in general.
I’ve been exposed to God my whole life. Not through Church or CCD, but my family. All of my relatives go to church every Sunday, my family being the exception. I was one of those kids who thought that God wasn’t real. I thought of religion and God as illogical, and no matter how many times I tried to give religion a chance, there was always some scientific fact that disproved it. I would look at my little Italian grandmother, who has a second grade education and can barely read, with question. She goes to church every Sunday and prays on a daily basis. It is all she knows. I figured she couldn’t understand the scientific reasons that created an endless number of fallacies in her religion, and that’s why she could embrace it so blindly.
It was not until a few years ago that I had an epiphany about religion. Religion is not supposed to be logical. It’s easy to say that God is fake and there’s no life after death, because we have nothing to prove its existence. But religion isn’t about being proven, it’s about living a good moral life. It is there to give directions to the lost, and hope to the hopeless, but most importantly, it’s about faith. It’s about believing through the facts and data that there is something bigger than yourself out there.
I am not an overly religious person. I don’t think about it during the day, I don’t refer my actions to the Bible, and I don’t allow it control any major parts of my life. But I do believe in Heaven, Hell, and God. I think hell is a place reserved for those who don’t live a moral life, and never intend to change. It’s a place where your soul and your body suffers unimaginable physical and mental pain. I don’t picture hell as the generic fiery cave under the earth. I think of it as something more personalized, perfected to torture you endlessly. For some it may actually be constant physical pain from white hot burning sulfur singing every nerve of your body. But for others the pain could be mental, or emotional, like reliving the death of a beloved family member, and experiencing the grief and suffering over and over again. As for the varying degrees of hell, proposed by Alighieri, I don’t believe such a thing can exist. There’s no beginners sinners branch of hell. If you’re in hell, you’re in hell.
I’m not a very religious person, but I firmly believe that, overall, God has a plan for everybody. We are all meant to do something with our lives, and there is always a reason behind everything God does. Hell was made for a reason just like everything else, so while one may be sent to burn in hell, another may learn from those mistakes and do twice the good. But then again, there’s no real definitive answer why God does what he does, religion’s not an exact science.
tamari:
Good analogy i think it is a great comparision.
I don't think homosexuals go to hell. In fact, if they are basically good people, they go straight to heaven.
Also, ben c, did you just diss Jesus? I know the blog is supposed to be open and stuff, and I respect your opinion, but isn't calling the lord and savior of millions of people "the original bum who was bat-shit-crazy, wandering the earth bumming food off of people." taking it a little too far? The blog is supposed to be about hell, so write about that and lay off of my god, please.
Well Hilary since you're not responding I’m going to attack your post.
God's number one rule is to "fear God and keep His commandments."
^I missed the part where fear of someone is the definition of love. Do you love your parents because you fear their punishment? Do you love your brother because he comes home and attacks you with a baseball bat?
"Pray and ask God for forgiveness, and He WILL forgive you"
^too bad Christianity works on the premises of 1 strike you're out. There is no second chance, once you’re in hell it's game over.
"God's number one rule is to "fear God and keep His commandments."---------->unlike the oppressing YOU-MUST-LEARN-RELIGION-THIS-WAY-AND-ACT-BY THESE-RULES Catholics"
^CONTRADICTORY STATEMENT!
"There's a difference in doing wrong and not realizing it, and knowing wrong, and doing it anyway. So, I don't think that people who were never exposed to teachings of God go to Hell. "
^what if the individuals opinion of right and wrong differs from God's? Why is his opinion better than anyone else’s? Apparently god says you can believe whatever you want as long as it is what I believe, if not you're going to hell.
well matt w, if that comment you made had the slightest bit of grammatical correctness then maybe I would have been able to discern some meaning from your post. What I said had nothing to do with explicitly hurting the feelings of people in this class, aside from me now saying that you have poor analytical skills. I would advise not trying to attack someone on the grounds of an inside joke you do not understand. Kthxbai
“God loves everyone. Heaven and everlasting life is something you have to work for. Hell teaches people the concept of fear in God. If there wasn't a belief in something Holy, in something good, what is life? What's the point in not believing when there is always a choice of faith? Or hope that there's something to look forward to, hope that there's something better than this life?”
Wow. Hil that was amazingly said. And I completely agree. Not everyone gets a free pass to Heaven, you have to prove to God, and yourself, that you are worthy of such a honor. And by going to hell, you realize what God has planned for you. God is looking out for everyone, and if he wants you to learn a lesson, to realize the sins you committed on earth, he sends you to hell. Not out of merely punishment, but for your own good. And heaven is something that many people look forward to. Because it is the place where you are surrounded by your loved ones, and where you are truly happy. And I do think that I live my life on the basis of hope. Hope for what is better to come.
First of all MattC
Christianity is NOT based on one strike you're out, in fact, you can have a million strikes if you are willing to try harder and realize you did something wrong.
Second, oaccording to my religion something isn;t a sin unless you know it is a sin when you did it. So,therefore, if you belief something that is incorrect but don't know that it is incorrect, than it is not as sin and therefore you won't being heading to hell.
Third, Fear means respect in this case. If you would just take the time to listen instead of just react and try to downgrade people's beliefs and make them feel bad, you might actually realize whta you're are saying eaisly falls apart. Anything else?
matt warrener, I'd just like to point out that your response to capone is pretty hypocritical.. considering it sounds like your begging for an argument to arise. Attacking mattc because of his values and beliefs, even if you think they're negative and out to "hurt" others supposedly, calling him heartless and callow, well that's just downright mean. just letting you know =]
To Matt W, defending Ivan, since me and him seem to be the same person most of the time: Why does consternation cause us delight? It shows when someone is really passionate about something. When people hold things dear to them, they get angry when these beliefs are called ludicrous. They defend what they think to the point of death, because their convictions are that strong. Passion is measured in response. There's no way to tell what's near and dear to someone but to question it, and the stronger their response, the more tightly held the belief.
Also, there may be a bit of schadenfreude involved. I'm not sure, but the first explanation is most true at least for me.
Matt C:
You said and I Quote: "it looks like i'll need hurtful comments...to catch the attention of people here." Whether it is an inside joke or not, this is not something most people would say.
Despite the fact that religion doesn’t play an enormous role in my life right now, it did at one time. I believed in God, Heaven and Hell, just as any closed-minded child would. From the services at church, my family and friends, I was raised with a specific idea of what each was—every other possibility was false. But as I got older and began to think on my own, I noticed inconsistencies in what they were preaching and decided that I no longer agreed with certain things they said.
Yes, I think there is a Hell and possibly Heaven, but I’m not so sure about God. Don’t kill me now, I believe there is some higher power out there, but I don’t think ‘it’ does or has done all that God is said to have accomplished. Anyway, the Hell that I perceive begins somewhat like the scene of floating souls in the movie Hercules (you know, the place run by Hades, Lord of the Underworld?!! Great movie BTW). Those who committed dreadful felonies and other misdemeanors, summoning an overall awful life are sent there. From here, (it may take weeks, months, even years depending how many people lived terrible lives from the time which you die), it will eventually be your turn to ‘pay’ (for lack of a better word) on behalf of all your wrongdoings. This I cannot begin to describe, for it will be significantly different for each unfortunate soul.
Whatever the consequence may be, Hell itself is not somewhere even the worst people want to go (sucks, but they’ll be going there anyway). In the Hell I believe exists, there is no scent or sound until your soul is drug out of the sea of floating souls. Then you are tortured in unexplainable ways, all depending on your past life. That also determines the length of your torture. Here, your nostrils burn from the smell of fire and rotting elements. You wish you would go deaf after hearing the shrieks of pain—yours and everyone else’s. Finally your soul is burned, erasing any physical evidence of your being in the Underworld (it would get way too crowded). All that’s left is if your body was buried in your first life.
I believe in the Sheol from the Old Testament, without-a-doubt. After death, your spirit is sent wherever it is destined to go. A place for spirits to reside where some of them will be resurrected to "everlasting life," while others are bound for "everlasting contempt," is way more realistic. Is you were a good, morally right person, then you deserve to be remembered as one of such good deeds. If you were the opposite, then you will surely be scorned for eternity.
Severity of sin can be measured. Sinning is going against morality or an overall understanding of what is wrong. For instance, intentionally harming someone physically would be considered a very high degree of sin in my book. That person would be tortured then isolated for the rest of eternity—far worse than simply being burned. Sin is sin, I know, but a kid stealing a piece of bubble gum shouldn’t be punished as harshly as someone who raped and killed another person.
Because I don’t completely believe in ‘God,’ it’s hard for me to answer this last question. To me, everyone has their own destiny. Their life is planned out for them by ‘the higher power’ in which ‘it’ already knows whether a person will go to Heaven or Hell. ‘It’ has your best interest in mind and knows you’ll learn the lesson you obviously didn’t while you were alive. This ‘higher power’ ultimately decides where you go after death based on the life ‘it’ created for you.
Molly-
You description of Hell was quite different from my own, but very likely. Although I never thought this into it, I liked when you said: “In hell, you would have no sense. No sight, no smell, no hearing, no sense of touch, or taste. You are physically handicapped, but you still have your mental capacity. You are still able to remember the sins that you have committed.” In my description, I didn’t erase the senses, but I believe that they wished they didn’t have them so they couldn’t experience the horrible things happening to them. This is a really controversial blog, but I believe you expressed your thoughts quite well =).
Einstein once said, "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." and "the intellect should not be made our god."
Smart guy.
This blog should be particularly interesting, because I have an exteremly cynical view on religion. As an athiest, I am quick to question any religious concepts that are thrown my way. I appreciate these ideas as just that: as concepts, I mean. I can't comprehend them being a reality, and I honestly think that the human ego is extremely inflated to think that our lives have universal implications.
Because of this skeptical view, I don't really ever imagine what Hell is like, and I don't really plan on ever contemplating it, either. I live in a hell enough. I don't need to imagine it. I must admit, however, that I find Satan to be an extremely intriguing character, and I'm not ashamed to say that I spend a large amount of time pondering his story and personality. I'm not a religious expert, and I don't pretend to be, so I usually try to steer clear of any discussions about him, and my philosophies about him. I think that now, however, is the appropriate time to adress these issues.
I've gotten mixed stories with how Satan came to be, so I'll avoid that topic. I wonder, however, if Satan gets a worse rep than he deserves. Is really evil because he assumed its title? All life is a balance of good and evil, of light and dark, but are the figures that assume this position really evil? Or are they good for taking a role that no one else wants to fill? Call me crazy, but I think about this stuff on a daily basis. I don't think Satan's necessarily evil because he wanted more power, either. I want more power in life. Does the desire for power make someone evil? If this is so, then everyone should be going to Hell.
I don't like the idea of having my fate chosen for me, which is one of the main reasons I stray from religion. I'd like to think that I'm the master of my own destiny, and the prospect of having a someone else, no matter how holy he may be, srutinize my behavior and punish me accordingly, isn't really appealing to me. Should I be condemned because my life doesn't mirror that which is outlined in the holy books? What makes the Bible's views any more valid than mine?
I don't even know where these blasphemic thoughts come from, because most of the people around me are religious. Well, let me rephrase that. Somewhat religious. I think the term "religious hypocrites" fits nicely here. My mom never goes to church, not even on holidays, but she has the audacity to lecture me on my atheist beliefs. "I worry about you, Maegan," she'll tell me. "I'm afraid for you. If you don't believe in something bigger than yourself, then you're missing out in life." Thank you for that input, mother. Personally, I'm experiencing life just fine, without the help of any higher diety.
I find that these questions are really hard for me to answer. I mean, I don't even believe in the place! How can I determine whether something is spiritual or worldy if I don't think it exists? I can't. I don't even feel comfortable pretending about such a thing. I don't think there is a Hell, and I don't think that souls travel there once they die. I think its amusing to think about, and its a really clever incentive to get people to do the "right" thing, but it doesn't affect me in any way. I'm getting really frustrated with this, because I feel like I'm babbling and not answering any of the questions. Really, though, I don't know HOW to answer them!
If, by some chance, I am wrong, and there really IS a Heaven or Hell, then my fate is most certainly decided. Maybe then I'll be able to answer this question better. Don't worry- I'll be sure to write.
Sarah Crane:
I'm pretty sure you're my life hero. I love the part where you described the process to get into Hell. I've never thought about it that way before, although its very promising to blasphemous crazies like me. It gives us hope that we may be able to escape our fate for turning our back on the holy light of God. I think your views were really interesting, and although I didn't necessarily agree with them, I've never thought to look at them from that angle.
I think it's funny that you consider my posts to be degrading when you were the one to attack mine. My assertions were to religion in general and not to any particular individual. But since you've brought it to the personal level I’ll follow you there. No, you aren't given a second chance if you do not believe what you did was wrong. If you do not believe in the 10 commandments and act against them, then you are essentially breaking the law of god even if you do not believe that what you are doing is wrong. So you can say that you are given unlimited chances to start over, and you're right about that, but only if you believe what you did was wrong. But if you do not and god does then his opinion seemingly over rules your own.
Occasionally the questioning I mentioned goes to far, and that I regret, but there's a fine line, up to which it is an extremely useful tool to both find out passions and find out things about said passions. Case in point. Last year in Costal's class, the day we talked about the death of rock and roll, just to see what would happen, I said that the 80's killed rock and roll. I got a five minute explanation of how the 80's did not do so, with numerous examples I went home and listened to. If I had not questioned something accepted, no one would have learned anything, and where's the fun in that?
Matt w, what I said was a reference to the attacks on made on specific religions, not to the individual.
"i made on"*
to Jen:
Thanks for your opinion...realy, no sarcacism. However, i wasn't attacking his beliefs. I was saying it seemed to me he only is saying certain things, which some would find harsh, to get attention, which I think is callow. Yes, it is mean and probably somewhat hypocyrtical but why does he have to attack something some people hold near and dear in order to gain attention? isn't there a better, less hurtful way to do that?
Oh god, I just read the new comments and people are really getting pissed and going at each other now. This worries me as much as it interests me, and if I'm being honest, even I'm ready to post in anger, mostly because of ben c. Ben, you're comment is loaded with what I call anti-Christian zeal. And like I said, zealots of all kinds worry me. You are all starting to worry me. I worried myself with how honestly pissed I am with some of these comments. I'm trying to stay calm and objective, but its a little hard with a topic as touchy as this.
Never mind, people seem to be calming down.
Again, attacking religion not people. But I realize that I might come off as a tad high-strung haha. My opinion is that I have a very high opinion of my opinion. for now though i can't fight these E-battles any longer because oakcrest needs to clean house at sectionals tomorrow. so farewell and goodnight to all my newly made "friends".
Matt C:
First of all didn't attack your post. I attacked your comment about attention and hurtful comments. Second, as I said, if you don't know or think it is wrong, it is not a sin. this is his opinion and rules.
To Matt W, defending Ivan, since me and him seem to be the same person most of the time: Why does consternation cause us delight? It shows when someone is really passionate about something. When people hold things dear to them, they get angry when these beliefs are called ludicrous. They defend what they think to the point of death, because their convictions are that strong. Passion is measured in response. There's no way to tell what's near and dear to someone but to question it, and the stronger their response, the more tightly held the belief.
I was going to post something, but this sums it up. Nobody agrees on a single thing. Even when this blog has the idea of "post what you believe, you can trust us", people are not truly involved. They bite their tongues, not allowing their true feelings to flow through. The thought of seeing others fighting for what they believe in is what truly makes me beam.
Also, think before you speak. I was the one ho chastised those who started throwing insults around in the gender blog. Furthermore, if seeing a person blow up was what I wanted, did you not just provide the very prize I aimed for?
You're attacking the religion that people believe in.
Ivan:
Very wise you are so I am sorry. Please accept my humble apologies and Dan,too, I guess, since you two are essentially the same person.
Matty w;
it didn't seem to me like you "attacked" anybody. I actually agreed with you on everything you were saying there. Especially when you made the correction that Christianity is not based on one strike you're out, and that you get a million strikes...because you do. No matter the sin, a christian is always welcome to confess the sin to the priest, and the sin will forever be vanished from your records.So you get as many chances as you wish in order to redeem yourself. However, if you never confess your sins and keep sinning, well then of course you'll strike out.
Meg, since you are amazing, you like amazing Fiona, also get Heaven in the Gospel according to Sarah.
Also, did you guys know that reincarnation was originally a belief included in the Christian faith, but that it was later rejected at the Second Council of Constantinople in 553 CE?
It kind of saddens me that I know things like this, but it sure does help in the developement of my faith.
ugh i have to make one last comment. so you're telling me if i rape and kill someone and think what i did was right, god will forgive me for it and admit me to heaven? somehow i don't think that will fly. this is really the last comment, i'm peacing
Hell. Hell, hell, hell, hell, hell! HELL. Sorry, I just had to get that out of my system. When I was a kid, now too actually, I was not allowed to say Hell. It was considered a “bad word”. Now, I’ve already had two assignments on the very place! Interesting how that works out.
So back to the main subject. Hell.
I do not believe Hell exists. Period. I think it is just some made up place, and really, every time I hear it, I immediately think, oh it’s an American thing. I don’t know why, but my opinion is probably helped out by the whole “Jersey Devil” nonsense. People who do bad deeds in their life do not deserved to be locked up in the Hells of peoples’ imagination. However, there is a solution. I prefer to mix up two ideas. I believe that there is a Heaven. I also believe in reincarnation. For example, when someone has lived out their life to the best of their abilities, that person will get to choose one of two choices. They can either stay in Heaven for as long as they like, OR they can be reincarnated. When they are reincarnated, they will have a better life than their previous. Like…a farmer in one life becomes a rich merchant in the next. However, this also is true for those who have committed terrible crimes and deeds, although they move in the opposite direction. Those people move down on social ladder. For instance, a greedy slave trader would become a slave in his next life. So really, those who do “bad” do not have a place like Hell to live for the rest of their existence. Rather, they have a plain white nothingness that they wait in to be reincarnated back into the world.
My belief probably stems from the environment around me. The Heaven part is the “American” part of the life-death cycle, and the reincarnation is obviously from “Asian” origins. This was probably taught to me awhile ago by my parents and grandfather, but I know I have believed it for quite some time. The Heaven part is probably formed from exposure to the world ideas and thoughts around. So basically, I made up my own ending, by combining the best of both religions. (I am very greedy, and I want everything. Just Kidding, I have no idea why I just wrote that. HA. Anyways…)
Wow okay. So I think that I would have to choose the former, that there is a place you can go. I have thought about this a lot too, and I think that is there ever was a Hell, it would definitely have an entrance like Hades. Hades is the Underworld of Greek Mythology, to which I am obsessed about. They have this whole elaborate way of journeying down there, alive or dead. Though, I must say that attempting to go there alive runs the risk that you’ll never comeback out. Nevertheless, it is possible to the Greeks to get to Hades if one wished, thus, I will side with them who I favor.
Well, given that I don’t believe in Hell…nope. Not really. Nine levels of Hell? Eight elevators/ escalators? This just seems silly to me. However, I do think that the severity of your crimes factor into how badly you become reincarnated. A merchant, who kills animals, may become the animals he kills. However, a merchant who cheats his customers may become an unsuccessful farmer. I don’t know if that shows what I am trying to say about severity factoring in or not, but I think you get the picture. I don’t think there is a great being in the sky that makes the decisions. I just think that there is some force in nature that observes us, and when our lives end and class is over, we get our grades for this class called Life.
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK! (My squeal if you are in my class) IT"S ALMOST HALLOWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN!!! AYAYAYAYAYAYAYYAYA!!!!! =)
Matt:
Truly, if you really, deep, deep down believe that rape and murder are ok, which most likely means there is some disfunction between the brain and conscience, than it is not a sin. End of question. But, do you, or anyone for that matter, think that they are ok, in any terms of the word?
Tamari:
Once again, thanks for backing me up:)
Matt. Do any people really think rape and murder are O.K.? Really? You have to ask? How about rapists and murderers?
To MattW:
Yes, yes, no need to apologize.
It was improper wording in the first place. It was in part a pun, and even a slight jab at how strongly people fight over the subject of religion. I really need to be less subtle with my jokes on the internet.
THE PHILLES HAVE JUST WON THE WORLD SERIES!!!!!!!!!
YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Just thought it should be noted no matter how random.
Dan:
The question is do they think it is okay or do they know it is wong but do it anyway to sastify thier desires?
To be honest, I rarely think of Hell. It rarely comes to either my mind or my lips, not even as a convenient swear-word. It seems like an odd and over-generalized concept to me.
I cannot believe that an omnipotent being would really have just a set of one-size-fits-most punishments. It just seems singularly careless. If this God really cared about the fate of these beings, He would take circumstances into account. But any God that has nothing better to do than sit around coming up with punishments for specific individuals, or even specific sins, can’t be very powerful or important. If He had significant responsibilities he would have better things to occupy His mind.
And I can’t really imagine a personal Hell. I suppose generic torture, lakes of fire, and the stench of brimstone would be frightening. But I do not believe I’ve done anything to deserve that. At least, not at this point. And I can’t think of a punishment made just for me. There are no monsters I particularly fear, no smells known for sickening me, no people I really hate, no tasks I find loathsome. (Oh, I’m sure there are ones that I would, but I haven’t had them inflicted on me yet, so they’re not relevant.) I think I just don’t care enough to really be effected.
Where did I get these ideas? Out of my own head. My family does not follow any particular religion. Most of them are a combination of common sense, good stories, and blind belief in the impossible.
The worldly origin of the word sounds more likely. At least to me. A trash-heap is infinitely more disgusting than the residence of souls.”Everlasting contempt” is an interesting concept, but it seems to me that being scorned is not necessarily a punishment. Continual contempt eventually builds a kind of pride, a scorn for the scorners. And frankly, everlasting life sounds boring to me. There comes a point when you have seen everything you wish to see, and simply wish to be quit of it all. If you could not, you would go insane.
But everlasting life on a trash pile would be a horrible punishment indeed. Though time would dull it eventually, by making the horrific routine.
If some God has set out perfect punishments for every sin, he has severely wasted his time. I do not know what comes after death, but I’m sure no one has personalized it. I don’t like to think of any being passing judgment on another. The omnipotent should have better ways to waste their time, and anyone less knowing has no right to judge another creature. And Dante, I think, was making a political point as much as a moral one.
I do not care to imagine the worst sin possible. The worst crimes are committed by the already insane, and punishing them is pointless.
I like to think that if any creature is controlling the cosmos, it must be sane. This means a minimum of illogical, contradictory character traits that would make death miserable for many people. I don’t think of religion or the afterlife often. A sane master, if any, is what I ask and respect. And the cruel must be insane.
Well, since they do it, obviously they don't think it's wrong enough to stop, and isn't that the only way to tell?
YEAH PHILLIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!THEY FINALLY WIN IN MY LIFETIME,MY LIFE IS NOW COMPLETE!!!!!!
Though if we are going to have a Hell, Sarah's way of getting there seems reasonable. I guess it would make sense to have a holding-bin for the worst sinners.
I'm still just inclined to call them insane. In which case, Hell would be a small room in total isolation, where these people cannot harm anyone anymore.
Well, here's an example:
You copy an aswer on a test. you know its wrong but do it anyway way because you want a good grade. Is that wrong? Yes. Unless for some reason you have a mental disabilty that melds the lines between right and wrong, you would be committing a sin. they do it to sastify a desire not becuase the think it is right or wrong.
Matt w, some people who murder believe they do it for the greater good:
re: Gormogon on Bones
Janiru -
"Once again, I really don’t believe (or even care) that hell exists. If I did hypothetically, I like to picture lots and lots of fire. I don’t necessarily think it would smell bad, but smell like…. fire, which I think smells pretty nice."
Lol i lovee the smell of fire. But its so weird. I would picture it as being cold, very very cold, and dark. BUTT, that is the influence of Greek Mythology once again. But yes, i wouldn't mind living around fires, they do smell lovely. =)
Ivan-
"Why do I think this way? It isn’t because of my family, who as atheists never mentioned religion at all, and by never mention, I mean at all. I remember even as a kid, when asked about my religion by some of my peers, I had ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA."
Whoa, that's really cool. I'm pretty sure i have never met anyone who was raised atheist, but that's really unique and awesome. Ha, but i was the same way with my religion. Like, i had NOOO idea what i was. Then one day i was just like, "Are we Buddhists?" My parents said yes, and i was like, "Ok." lol.
Also, the reason I have been so active on this blog is my family were watching the Phillies and I, not being a baseball fan, am left all alone.
Sarah:
First i am so happy to hear someone else watches Bones besides me. Second, did he or did he do it to fill a dark desire for human flesh and bones? If you really can't tell whether something is right or wrong than how can you possibly be held accountable for it. Obviously, we can't let these people run amuck they would reck havoc but, i believe, when it comes time for spiritual judgement, they would not be considered sinners if they actually believed what they did was right. Once again the major belief:"it is only a sin if you know it is wrong"
See though Matt, that's exactly my point. There are people who see rape and murder as something acceptable. We figure cheating is wrong, but it's not nearly enough to stop most of us. They may know it's "wrong" but it's "wrong" the same way we think cheating is "wrong" on a test. It's not something that could completely mess up the other person's life, its just an action, just as bad or good as any other. Zodiac figured that murder was alright, since it got him slaves for the afterlife. He didn't think what he was doing was wrong at all. Do you? Yes. Do the scum who go to jail repeatedly for murder and rape think so? Apparently not, or they wouldn't keep doing it.
"New born son
Life has won
Take this turn then he'll run
Run away from all that's been
I have done, I have seen"
Ok, I'm taking a break from writing my descriptive essay; because it turns out, I really suck at writing descriptive essays. At least, I suck at writing them about any of the three topics.
I saw the topic's name and I squealed in ecstasy, for that is pretty much my job as a human being. Then I read the rest.........
Jon Scheaffer's blog starts NOW
Though Jon Scheaffer is an orthodox atheist, his views in no way reflect the views of atheists as a whole. Any offended patrons of Blogger are advised to direct their complaints towards Mr. Scheaffer.
Hell does not exist, but if it did, I'd be in with that 4%. Not because I've committed enough terrible deeds to warrant a trip to hell, but just so I could be rid of the other 96%.
My belief came from...I have no idea. I've been an atheist since I was six, do you honestly expect me to remember some revelation that caused me to become one? You do? Well I guess I'll have to make one up...
At age six, I realized hell didn't exist, along with the rest of religious deities and "deathlands." It came to me in a message from God. She said, "This message will self-destruct in 5,4,3"
"HOLY CRAP!” I thought calmly to myself.
"Speak not of my feces!!" interdicted God.
Then the God section of my brain exploded, and I became an atheist.
I believe hell as a worldly destination sounds much more realistic. This is mainly because hell as a worldly destination isn't realistic at all, and since hell really isn't real, the worldly hell is realistic. (Class, say hello to Mr. Paradox)
I don't believe in circles of hell because I don't believe in hell. (I can see this getting real redundant real quick).
It brings me great pleasure to say I was able to learn a new word just from reading the blog’s question. Actually, I was able to learn a new definition of a word I already knew: reconcilable. “The quality of being able to cause to submit to or accept something unpleasant”
So no, I’m not able to believe in God as that sort of being because I’m not able to believe in god as any sort of being.
PS Yea I wrote this last night and forgot to post it. silly me.
Jen:
Whoa, two comments on you in a row! So Weird! (haha good show)
"I think God is a joke."
Tru dat. I've tried and tried to believe, but found it impossible.
Alright, Trnasformer time.
Sorry, Matt, but I don't follow that belief. Wrong is wrong, and cannibalistic murder is wrong no matter how you spin it. Also, in the season finale, they explained how Gormogon and Zack believed that, by ridding the world of members of secret societies (Knights of Columbus) they were making the world a better place.
Also, I was a little worried that I was the only Bones lover out there. I'm glad that isn't so. Also, it comes back on Nov. 5, and you can watch full episodes, including the aforementioned last finale, at hulu.com.
Dan:
Good Point. But at that point I would think they have some "loose connections" and how can someone with mental instability be considered a sinner? I don't thin than can. I am being clear or I am just not making sense?
I am pretty sure that there is a hell. My hell would defiantly be engulfed in fire filled pits and flames. All that you can hear is the high pitched screaming cries for help from the newer entries of prisoners who still think that they can make it out, but never will. The prisoners of hell would always be hungry and thirsty continually, but there would be nothing to satisfy them. The odor would be made up of a mix of rotten eggs and sulfur that has been over cooked in a microwave. That smell would mix with that of burning bodies and decaying corpses. You would sort of be in a jail cell, and forced to suffer the pain that you caused the people on Earth, literally. Say that you stabbed and murdered an innocent man with a knife, well, for the rest of eternity you would be continually sliced with a dull blade, and experience the pain tenfold. There are no different sections or levels for the different cruel people, just one cramped and damp caves like room where you would be punished for all eternity. All of the things that you loved on earth would be forgotten, and you can only remember the pain and suffering that you endured through your short existence on Earth. Also, there would be no separation between the murders and the people who committed suicide, or the people who had lost their minds, and they would all be together, basking in their misery.
I agree more with the idea portrayed in the New Testament, where the fires never burn out. I believe that god has given people a chance to prove their loyalty to his concepts on Earth, and if they fail, they do not continue on to the next phase. I also do not believe in different circles of hell, where people are separated. Part of your punishment is dealing with the other insane beings trapped for eternity with you. A sin is a sin, whether it be committing suicide or murdering somebody. I think that the worst sin that you could possibly commit is impossible for me to think of. The cruel and twisted minds of those in hell don’t really make perfect sense, so it is hard to guess what some lunatic has planned out in his clouded head.
I learned most of these beliefs with a mix between my church and my family. I am a Catholic and through my 8 (I skipped a year =]….) years of CCD all that I basically picked up on the two main things that they focused on. One, go to church every Sunday, and if you don’t god will know because god is ALWAYS watching you, and two, do bad things and you will end up in hell. As for the thought of god being so loving and forgiving, yet sending some of his children to hell, I think that god needs to take control in some way. If god didn’t punish his children then they would run amuck, doing whatever they wanted, and harming helpless people. God created hell as a way to keep his people in check.
Sarah:
Thanks for the lit tidbit. ANd that's fine if you don't believe that, it is your chocie. I just thought I should explain that according to my religion, it isn't considered a sin. It was really in order to show Matt C that it isn't completely black and white and there are exceptions and reasons for most things.
Yes hell exists; it exists not so much in a physical plane, but more as a place of mental torture, devoid of all contact. It is quite similar to a penitentiary Mr. Cervi gave a brief lesson on, as the prisoners were completely devoid of all human contact and entertainment, all they had was one hour of walking a day. This complete isolation would be for me the worst of all things, especially with no books, or other entertainment. This belief was shaped by my time spent in Sunday school and in church learning that those who sin go to hell. My personal hell was created mostly by the view that hell is what is most uncomfortable for the person involved. To go to hell religiously all that you need to do is not expiate your sins. However, in my world atoning for your sins does not mean that you are going to confessional, but suffering from guilt. I am my own worst taskmaster/disciplinarian. I judge myself harshly and I have my own moral code that was formed individually, and I like to think independently.
Both of these places seem realistic to me, and as the Bible had multiple authors, it is possible that both places are a “hell” one used as an analogy, the other the indescribable place. If I had to choose though, being thrown in a pile of burning, rotting flesh and garbage while still aware seems an awful lot like hell to me.
Sin varies in degree, yes. Imagine a pure white piece of heavy watercolor paper pure white and imagine that each imagined sin is a drop of dark blood dripped onto the snowy surface. This is the “sin-o-meter” that would exist if I was ruler of all. Various sins have different amounts of blood attached. I imagine the three seers huddled around a book with one eye, dropping blood onto papers. The worst sin of all is the taking of a life, or the robbing of a choice, increasing in intensity with the innocence of the being killed. Animals and small children are chief among these innocent, with their destruction and perverting being lords of all sin. With irony to this belief, I stand on the principle of choice and human safety from violent animals, but prefer relocation before euthanasia – ALWAYS.
God created all, and he did a good job, but there is one fatal computer virus according to the dreaded CCD. It is called free will. The ability to choose is what creates all of the evils in the world. To this argument I throw natural disasters such as earthquakes, plagues, and hurricanes. In response, a lovely harmony of crickets. So I believe that there is a higher power, but it is probably not as affected by bonhomie as we think. God seems much closer to the ancient Greek and Roman gods who were quick to anger and hard to please.
-- Ali B
-response-
Jordan - I hope you feel better.
Sarah C - I like your personal hell (as an idea).
Shout out to all of those who attended many forced years of CCD. May we somehow be able to fix this wrong for our children, and perhaps be able to answer the questions the future Matt C will ask.
Ali
Matt, and also if they were truly mentally ill (which Gormogon wasn't) and not just twisted individuals, I believe they will be sent back to earth to try again.
Yeah, but who decides who's sane? The idea of morality is an invention of society. This'll be the only thing I'll think about apologizing for today, so listen good: Deciding that anyone who doesn't follow your code of morality is insane is the kind of thinking that made the Inquisition possible.
Well, unforutunately, i don't believe in reincarnation but that is a clever thought. And i agree about Gormogon
Danny society doesn't judge if their insane; God KNOWS if they're insane.
Matt, did you read what I wrote about reincarnation being voted out of Christionity?
Ughh…so I do not like this topic. I am not religious in any way and I don’t really plan to be. When I think about my life and all of my actions I never relate them to my beliefs in God or other deities. It’s probably just an adolescent thing or whatever, but I think that religion is too controversial and thought consuming to concern myself with. However, even though I don’t believe in a particular religion, I like to lean on the fact that life doesn’t end when you die. There has to be a place where people go and eternally live with the ones that they have loved and lost in the past. So if there is a ‘heaven’ that means there has to be a ‘hell’. Still, no one knows what it looks, smells, and feels like. It has an infamous reputation and is the place where people curse others.
I don’t even know to start with the description of hell and this response is going to be all over the place and probably hypocritical somehow. So the stereotypical and well-known setting of hell is hot and fiery. Flames of death and rusted metal jail cells enclose all who enter hell. There are screams and cries for help, although none are ever received or answered. People suffer and mercy is never shown. This is the general description of hell, but I liked Molly’s response to this question. She described it as a place of mental suffering, which I think is much more effective when attempting to teach people their sins. Silence is not only something awkward in society but it makes peoples’ minds run and too much of it can make people crazy. Silence for eternity would be probably the worst punishment there is because it leaves you alone with no one to talk, and relate to. So this makes me think of what Matt C. said.
“Apparently this god has the perfect values and morals and because he so god damn right about everything we should emulate his actions? Well how about we hold up for a second and consider how idiotic that is. Someone just declared that their opinions are right, you have to believe in them or else you will be tortured for eternity.”
So true Matt. Kind of hypocritical if you ask me. Forgiveness and second chances are commonly preached in religion and are said to be the qualities gods posses, therefore, hell would be the opposite of the attributes presented by God.
I assume that my ‘beliefs’ come from my parents as well as my other relatives, although as far as my other relatives go, I don’t necessarily agree with them. As a child I went to Sunday School and church regularly every Sunday, but it became hard to schedule when I got older. My parents want me to learn about religions and different beliefs but don’t pressure anything onto me. My other relatives are very religious and can sometime be one-sided with what they believe. Still although they impact my beliefs, I am able to develop my own morals as an individual.
So, I think a hell of some sort exists however, its not the fiery madness its put out to be.
That's why it is really indiviualized for each person, Dan. No one can decided moralilty but you, amd i don't literally mean you. as for the sane and insane, if God is all-knowing, which I believe, than he will know the truth.
Yes, Sarah, I did, well at least the dat and confrence title. was there more?
No, Matt, I just thought it went well with your early arguement of the Bible being changed by people.
I really don't think you can take every word of the Bible literally, like there is a passage in the Bible stating that women are not allowed to wear braided hair in church. You kind of have to stick to the basic truths and go with what your heart and conscious tells you.
At a mass I attended two weeks ago the deacon stated, “Once you take God out of your life, destruction occurs. We need God in our lives for there to be a balance. When eve took a bite out of the apple is when all of the mayhem began.” I am raised in a catholic home and I have never questioned my religion I have only questioned my belief in my religion. In the words of the wise Hillary Rosenberg, “The one who believes and dies has nothing to loose and everything to gain while the nonbeliever has everything to loose if nothing to gain.” I understand that the bible is not a reliable source but that does not mean that I do not believe in it. So I believe in hell, heaven, purgatory, God, Saints, and etc. for one reason. That reason is...…. If what we do here has no consequences then why are we here? If what we do does no matter and our actions do not have consequences then there is no reason for our being. I need to think and at least believe that all of those who inflict pain on others or have committed severe sins have punishments and that even those who may not be caught will have their due time.
I do not know for sure what hell looks like, smells like, and feels like but I do have ideas that come from the bible, my Priest, friends, and family. Matthew 13: 49 says” So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, in 13:50 he says, “And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.” When I picture hell, I see flames of fire, rotted chains, and black coal. There are dirty and lifeless creatures working to fulfill the devils needs. They have no souls and are damned to hell for eternity. I can smell the awful stench of the bodies and smoke. Hell feels like torture and rough surfaces that surround its entire existence. I think that reasons for being damned to hell are endless. A few reasons would it be, a sin, not believing in god, or not putting God first in your life. But these are my beliefs and God is always first in my life. I am not talking about swearing, cursing, and a tiny sin. I am speaking of major sins such as murder, rape, and other felonies. I do believe however that you can pray for forgiveness of your sins to an extent.
Others who are bound to "everlasting contempt" (Dan. 12:2) is more realistic to me. I believe in the spiritual aspect of hell but not the physical aspect. I think that it is the decisions that you make by choice in life that determine whether your soul goes to heaven, hell, or purgatory. I do think that sins can be forgiven through prayer and belief in God’s love for you and I also think that there are degrees of sins. Some sins no matter how much praying you do can not be forgiven. The worst sin that I can think of would be first degree murder. The can be no amount of praying done for a cold blooded murder. The consequences would be damned to hell for eternity.
This last thought provoking question has brought to my attention the love and grace of God and yet through what he preaches hell would seem as the last resort of his preaching’s. It is in a way IRONIC how God is loving and graceful but his power can choose our fate in eternal life. God created us with free will and voices to understand that all choices may not be great, but it is what we do in the time of despair that defines who we are and eventually we will be judged a the gates of heaven. His power may determine it, but he gives us every reason to be in heaven and guides to follow. It is like a student taking a test, there are rules and study guides to help pass a test and you know that you have every resource at your finger tips, but it is how much effort you put into for the ultimate outcome.
SKILLARY ROSENBURG--------
Of course I had to read your blog I mean you get your praise on all the time.
“That is a shivering thought in itself.” - Awwwwwww!
“And, it's simple to get rid of your sins- repent of them. Pray and ask God for forgiveness, and He WILL forgive you.”- I agree one hundred percent!
“You have to earn your way to Heaven; it isn't an easy road to be a believer, but the rewards are obviously greater and more phenomenal than I can ever imagine.”- I think that that statement goes back to what you said to me that day at lunch. Being a believer is priceless and like you said, the “rewards are phenomenal.”
I loved every point that you made throughout the entire blog. It was insightful and I love how much faith you have in God. I know that my faith will get to be as strong as yours, but it will take a little bit of time.
Hmm, interesting thought. You could most defintely be correct. I'll have to consider it then. May reincarnation exists would would give further proof to may deja vu and purgatory thoery that i mentioned in my very first post.
I definetly agree, the Bible can NOT take the bible literally. Did i already say that?
I think you're being clear enough, but there is a distinction between Insane and Evil. There are murderers and rapists who are just plain insane, aka Son of Sam, but then there are those like the Zodiac who are completely rational, but do not exactly do what we consider 'good.'
This is true Dan and i must say I don't really have an answer to that and that is where a little faith comes in. So, sorry if you thought I could answer that because I can't :(
If god's so powerful and loving and gives you a chance to redeem yourself and all that, why make people who are nutballs who are incapable of following his rules? (I do so enjoy these little chats)
To Morgan C
As I read your blog I was astounded at how ridiculously similar our ideals and beliefs are. You had some really good quotes that put a complex ideal pretty simply.
“I want to believe in a God but I don’t necessarily follow any certain religion. I don’t agree with the views of Catholicism which is the religion I was raised. I like to hold my own beliefs and ideas of what God is.”
I’m Catholic and I don’t agree with the religion either. I think it’s too closed minded and strict. I like to think of God and religion in general as guidelines for a better life, not focus on whether or not you can get into heaven. I like the ideals most religions preach, but I don’t like the rules they impose on their followers.
I am one of the sixty-percent of Americans that believe in hell. I believe that it is cold *figuratively), dark, and a generally lonely place- the whole nine yards. I don’t follow any guidelines to believe what hell is like though…I just kind of came up with my own theory as time went by. I don’t really think that anyone has the jurisdiction to tell a person what THEIR perspective of hell should be like. No one has been to hell- well obviously- so no one can say for sure what it looks, smells, or feels like. Your perspective of hell should be all your own. Of course, this is not to say that the media, church, or piers do not influence your views. I believe that hell smells putrid and is full of burning flames. This is a result of both the media and religion. After seeing hell depicted as such a horrid, smelly place, you cannot help but to succumb to popular views. This being said, it is highly likely that some people (mainly Satanists) probably have a completely different view on what hell is. Hell is probably this magnificent place for them. (I wouldn’t know) I assume these people are very mean spirited and evil though.
With my vision of hell being this lonely, smelly, horrible place, it is only fitting to assume that you have to have been truly horrible in your life to gain entrance in the afterlife. This belief that I have is mainly based on religion only because what the church has taught me is really all I know about hell. I try not to watch movies about hell just because I think it’s unnecessary. SO anyway, to go to hell, I guess a person has to have done something horrid like kill mercilessly and not feel an ounce of remorse for their deeds. Or maybe it would be when someone does something horrible and feels remorse but does the same thing time after time.
I think that the idea of the Old Testament’s sheol is more believable to me. I guess that other unpronounceable one is kind of sadistic in a way. It just is nicer to think or the good in life instead of focusing on the bad, thus, sheol sounds good to me- well sort of it’s still kinda bad but better than that G place.
I kind of want to agree with Alighieri's whole nine circles concept, but I just don’t. I think that hell is just hell. You’re categorized as good or bad not bad to the fifth degree or good to the second power. This is a little unclear to me though because in the bible there are apostles and saints though…
As for the last question: Honestly….I can’t really say. Life sucks. Do what you can for it, but don’t expect to fully comprehend EVERY aspect of the world!
There are no questions here, just as there are no attacks. I try to get people to think. Getting people angry is not in my mood at the moment. Just a lot of food for thought.
I can only speculate, but he does it in order to show a, that all people are important, even the nutballs, and b, in order to make those who aren't debilitated releaize just how good their life really is.
FYI, not angry, you have vaild questions and are being respectful about it
In reponse to others:
It's kinda like I said in my blog...no one has the right to tell you what to believe. Have you been to hell? Didn't think so. People can be as religious or saitanic about this as they have been led to believe.
I grew up in a Catholic environment. My family and I went to church almost every Sunday despite my constant unwillingness. I didn’t believe that going to church had any effect on me for the better, or for the worse. I still obeyed, however, and I even went to CCD. Eventually, my parents became tired and fed up with my reluctance to be involved with any religious activities. After my Holy Communion, CCD and I were done. Most of the people I know kept up with CCD until 8th grade. I did not and I could honestly careless. Oh darn, I can’t get married in a church. Whatever will I do?! First of all, I don’t think I would’ve survived if I had to go through CCD until 8th grade. Second, I don’t even want to get married in a church, despite my mother’s dreams. So, I basically developed my own beliefs on whether God, Hell, and Heaven are real.
I cannot honestly say for certain that hell is true. No one can. It’s all a matter of opinion. I partially believe in hell, but I don’t picture a fiery pit of doom filled with dead bodies. That’d be a bit extreme for God (who loves everyone right?) in my opinion. I imagine a place where someone would go to admit and repent their sins. I don’t imagine either heaven or hell having a scent. I think of a place where almost all your senses die along with your body, but maybe that’s just me. I have to question what happens to our bodies and souls if there is no hell. Do we just lay there in our coffins? Do we watch over our bodies and our loved ones? Are we still suffering once we’re dead? I also have to wonder how one goes to hell. Killing is a one-way ticket to hell, no doubt. I agree with Tarah when she says that remorse is key. I think that if someone doesn’t feel remorse for their sins, they should be sent to hell because I picture hell as a place to repent for your sins. Still, the thought of a possible pit of fiery doom, resembling gehenna, remains in the shadows of my thoughts. Sheol definitely sounds a bit more realistic and more like what comes to mind when someone says “hell.”
I never pictured hell the way Alighieri does. I didn’t think hell was complex enough to have levels. That’s a pretty in-depth analysis of hell, if you ask me. But it seems like a pretty adequate description, though. I would believe that IF I believed hell was true for sure. The worst sin I can imagine would be intentional murder. The most awful punishment, in the ninth layer of hell, would probably be torture. No one can be sure.
I’m not even sure whether I believe in God or not either. But I don’t believe God sends people to hell. They send themselves. God doesn’t force anyone to sin, so he shouldn’t be blamed for those who have. It is mentioned in the bible that God, even though I’m not entirely convinced he exists, does not send anyone to hell. But the question still remains.
Molly- “While there, you would feel such a sense of loneness that you lose who you truly are and you will never be able to forget the horrible crimes you have committed in your lifetime. In my hell, there wouldn’t be any smell or any noise, just complete silence. Silence is one of those things that make you think. Think about where you are and who you are. In hell, you would have no sense. No sight, no smell, no hearing, no sense of touch, or taste. You are physically handicapped, but you still have your mental capacity. You are still able to remember the sins that you have committed.”
I really agree with your statement. I thought no one shared my opinion of hell until I read your blog. I feel the exact same way about the senses just vanishing. All you can do is remember the sins you have committed.
To my main female Ali, props on recognizing god as a fickle little man, more like the Roman gods than what we make Jesus to be.
Also to Ali for being well and truly frightened of the Penitentiary. I feel your pain. I got chills listening to Cervi talk about that. I would go crazy after a day.
HIlface!
"There's a difference in doing wrong and not realizing it, and knowing wrong, and doing it anyway."
Great quote kiddo. The people who know what's wrong and still do it are the people who 'go to hell', as they say. Thats why theres that thing called a 'judicial system' that can differ between a child and a 'mature' adult commiting a crime.
...also I've been reading the 'battle' or whatever going on, and although this topic fuels the fire, I think that people need to relax and not take every statement said so seriously. This is why I'm not a big religious person because ridiculous arguments arise over it Oh an Jen, you're my favorite person ever!!
this blog is alomst the longest one ever only betten by the men and women one. but if we get five more posts, this one is the new champ.
Carly:
In case youare referencing me, i was definetly hot-heade and porbably went a little overboard. So sorry for "blowing up"
I just have to say, I love this topic just because of the immense passion involved with belief. Not only does it cause chaos, it actually made me think for a while, like a two days kind of while, not like an hour kind of while. Tricky. More like this in the future please, Bunje.
"I believe in the Sheol. Because I agree on the face that some people, or spirits after their death, who have committed the ultimate crime will face everlasting contempt. Everyone will always remember them as that horrible person, overlooking whatever great things they may have done in their lifetime. Although I am kind of shaky on the everlasting life part, I do agree with it in some aspect. If you were an amazing person, morally right, during your lifetime, you will always be remembered by someone for your good deeds and the impact you had on the world."
-Molly Gondolf
I totally agree with you on this one. In my blog, I didn't really comment on the Sheol part of the quesiton, however I think that you hit the nail on the head. Good people deserve good things, and those that sin so horribly in life deserve to be remembered that way. I understand exactly what you're saying, and your beliefs are very similar to mine.
officially the longest blog so far
I believe that there is a hell. There needs to be a place to punish the bad; there needs to be balance in the universe. Hell is a place with the most horrific conditions imaginable. Hell is a fiery pit deep within the ground that contains the agents of death and torment. These demons are sentenced to punish the wrong doers that are sentenced to burn in hell for all eternity. In this land of fire and brimstone the smell of smoldering flesh is pervasive among all areas of the vast underground. There is no sky in this eternal hell, only an enclosed environment, where smoke fills the air. The air of hell is that of one thousand oven’s heat, so much that the soles of the condemned feet burn onto the hard stone on which they walk.
I most likely got my views from religion and movies. I was never a very religious person, but the views of hell are some of the first images instilled in the followers. My view is most likely a hybrid of the movies that show hell as a demonic underworld and the Methodist view of hell. If I was to align myself with any religion, it would be of Methodist orientation. To me, if I am a good person I will be rewarded and sent to heaven, or a better place than I am right now. However, if I am a menace to society and linger with the dregs of society, I will most likely go to hell.
I would tend to think that hell is a worldly destination more than a spiritual. I do believe there are varying degrees of sin. The ranges of sin go from the most innocent of lying to some of the most severe, such as rape and murder. The ability to murder is a proving ground to see what type of person you really are. If a person murders someone they prove that they need to burn in the depths of hell for all eternity, like an egg on a hot skillet. If humans did not fear the consequences of their actions, they would not fear doing those actions. God would only be giving inside knowledge to sin and disobedience, to show the consequences.
I am going to sleep now, so good night to all those still actively particapting and ony who reads this. Sorry if I offended anyone today. I will try to keep it in check next time.
In response to Sarah C:
"Yes, I believe that hell exists. Hitler's got to go somewhere, right?" This is so true. I feel the exact same way. Why would there be a hell if there were no bad people to inhabit it?
In response to Billy C: KTB
In response to Jordan:
I miss you. No homo. I really want you to come back.
To Alice:
I don't really thing Hell could be in our minds. Whether you want to think that the human mind can sidestep the idea of hell, or just gets distracted from the idea, we can never suffer from a Hell in our mind. But thats just my opinion.
To Danny:
Yeah, the whole priest thing that you mentioned is pretty ridiculous. No one man can be that powerfully linked to God that all of our sins would be forgotten just by confining ourselves in him.
Whenever I think of hell, the move Constantine is the first image in my mind. If you’ve never seen the movie, the most general description I could give would be like the entire world how it is in present time except up in flames. Oh and there are these demon things (I suppose what people are in hell) that chase around Keanu Reeves. It’s ghastly, where grass would normally grow, there is desert, where screams filled your airwaves as if it were the only radio station within reach. Also the essay we read last week or so was very eye opening and thought provoking on the topic of hell. I honestly don’t care for religion but I suppose I have formed ideas from various teachings because there is no other notion to jump to. Despite the law, there is no judge of moral wrongdoing. I can’t say killing is wrong if you’ve practiced it your entire life and haven’t gotten any strife until I brought it up. I gather my beliefs from compilations of things I’ve heard or read that seems correct to me. I am not one to focus on the things I cannot label as reality because if I am not positive it’s real, why bother worrying about it? Be Realistic. I don’t know what could get you into a place that may not even exist? Sure the stereotypical response would be somewhere along the lines of killing someone or at least fucking someone’s life up. I mean yeah people do that stuff but the only place I see those intolerable jackasses going is to jail. Again another issue of that; is jail honestly an equal punishment for the crime, but that is a rant for another blog. You get into hell and tell me how you got there, how about that?
Like I said before, I am not religious and I very rarely believe in something I can not see or experience for myself. The New Testament sounds like the right choice for me. I suppose the frequent bludgeoning of my brain with spiritual analogies from my stepmother has caused me to have a closed mind to the Old Testament. I’ve heard every insane theory of hers and it kills me to try and understand anything spiritual. Everlasting life and contempt, in the form of a realm, is stupidly unreal. If speaking of personal everlasting life and contempt, I can visualize that. (A person hating themselves for doing something wrong or a widow seeing everlasting life in her late husband.)
I’m not sure if I’m contradicting myself by saying I agree with this, but as I also stated earlier, I take my ideas from anything that sounds right to me. Thieves should not receive the same punishment as murderers. I can’t imagine the worst sin. Torture and murder are up there I suppose. I wish I could know how the devil would punish a brigand. Probably he would perform the act that sent them to hell over and over, unconditionally, for the rest of eternity. Haha, sounds sick right?
If I believed in God I would say yes, it is alright for people to see Him as love even though he condemns people to hell. Essentially, God is about rules. Rules to live by, to be right by God. If you believe in Him and follow his ways, I suppose he has the right to condemn you. If you have your faith and follow the bible as ‘his word’ then you should have no issue with the consequence of eternal suffering.
In response to Jon S:
I admire that you have the ability to reconcile. This blog is not up your ally. Good job though :]
Hils- Reading your blog just made me feel like i was in church. It's probably the only thing I don't see eye to eye with you... no short jokes!
I love you girl, but the whole preachy thing just doesn't work for me.
P.S. PHILLIES WIN BYAAAAAHHHHHHH
Hils- Reading your blog just made me feel like i was in church. It's probably the only thing I don't see eye to eye with you... no short jokes!
I love you girl, but the whole preachy thing just doesn't work for me.
P.S. PHILLIES WIN BYAAAAAHHHHHHH
Hell has been a figurative and literal point of existence which at times I found myself often contemplating over Hell. I never had a problem with believing in Hell; whenever I thought about it, it was a matter of what form it was in and keeping myself from being banished to such a wrongful place. It's not like I'm some said Emo (As seen here http://images.paraorkut.com/img/graphics/20071111054913_gifs-animados-orkut-emo-02.gif [copy and paste link] ), I was just trying to figure out the faith within myself, thus it often came to mind as a result of my religious restlessness. Now that I have just about came to peace with myself on this matter, I rarely ave thoughts of the existence. On the occasions which I can not find within the hope and joy I am driven by, I sometimes think about having that eternal experience myself. However, I have nearly realized all my personal religious beliefs, and hardly think about the place myself.
When someone mentions Hell or I do think about it, I actually have a very specific image come to mind. It usually is completely covered in fire, with the sound roaring with blazes more powerful than anything ever seen on this Earth. Moans and screams come and go as ghostly images of infamous people come and fade into the darkness behind the fire. In the center in a boiling lake of hot lava as described in the piece we read as an assignment. A pretty vivid description that use to send chills up my spine.
I have come in my belief to take on a very liberal view of Christianity. You may even compare it on the same level which transcendentalism has been described, though I would not consider myself on that level. I believe in the whole Jesus and New Testament bit, and I do not consider myself ignorant of what is in the Bible. However, I believe in a high level of factors that could change many details for the entirety of the belief but fundamentally everything is the same. For example, I'm very open to the possibility of the “Big Bang” and all science being an implication of Divine power and how it works. Or maybe a little in disblief on certain stories, such as God “ordered” the Israelites to destroy the Palestinians.... the factor of human action probably the biggest in the overall belief system I have created. The fundamentals of Jesus and all that good stuff is their, but just with some logical twist. I would say this is a mix of parents, church, and my own personal search into myself.
With that rant said about my beliefs, I would have to take two stand points on how God works with men, deciding who goes to Hell and who doesn't. From one stand point, I would not say that Gods choices aren't logical, and obviously he's God so their not, but miscommunicated. As said in the bible, which is highly opened to interpretation, God has already completely laid out what will happen. Eventually, he will banish the Devil and all his followers into the debts of the bottomless lake of Hell and create the new universe. Essentially their are many more details, but this would be besides the point. The only thing we have to do as humans is belief in him, and that is how we choose our path between eternal damnation or eternal tranquility.
However, I do believe it can be taken from another perspective. God can bend the rules and decide on things however he wishes. Anything we wrote down and believe that is the case every time is a load of crap. Take the perspective or Christianity or your own belief in Hell. Now, if Hitler were highly engulfed in the praise of God and claim to have him in his heart, do you believe he is going to Heaven just because of this? Most people would probably say “no” as an answer to this rhetorical question. Now lets look at it from the other perspective. Do you believe Ghandi, a man who incorporated only a little Christianity into his own faith and whom has been known for contributions to society, now suffers a horrible fate lingering in the flames of the underworld. I would believe most people would say No to this as well. Now it's not a matter of whether this is right or not, it's a matter of logistics. I personally do not believe got is so ignorant of situation, especially when I consider the fact he's in every situation. Now whether it's definite they go to Heaven or Hell is another matter. There may very well be some form of purgatory that these people go to. There are still some things I have not discovered, and may very well never discover, that are blank spots in my system of belief. I will admit I am open to even the most radical of situations coming true: A full-fledged atheist, whom properly conducted their morals on Earth, may very well possess the capability of walking through the Pearly-White Gates for an eternity of happiness, even if they completely disagree with what I say now. I guess you can say, it's the nice mans view on things.
Well, I think in previous blogs or essays that we had to write (I don't really remember)I've made it clear to what my religious beliefs are, but I will reiterate anyway for anyone who missed them. No there isn't a such thing as hell. I believe that there is nothing that happens to you when you die, except in my perception you stay in the ground. This world was created for me to experience, and you have no actual life or meaning, but are shaped to however will best suit my current situation. So, when you die you don't enter a place where your soul burns or is tormented, and you definitely don't ascend to some glorious place to watch me. When you die you simply stop existing. End of story. When I die I won't go to heaven, hell, purgatory, or any other place people believe in. It seems when I die, everything in the universe stops and just disappears. You don't continue living, Barack Obama doesn't continue living, it just stops. The entire universe disintegrates in inky black nothingness. That's it. Now you may question how did we get here then, how do you explain Jesus, and all those other questions that fanatics seem to be concerned about with religion. To be honest, religion is a joke. Its all contradictory and is filled with fallacies and loop-holes and obvious impossibilities. Where is Jesus' middle life for instance, what the hell (haha) was he doing for the missing years of the bible? Anyone who sees a vision and hears "You’re the son of God," doesn't just disappear for years to cope with that. Coping with that doesn't even make sense, embracing it should be more realistic. Another fallacy is the parting of the Red Sea. A lot of people don't know this but there was a volcanic eruption that occurred as the Jews were following Moses, which explains the separating of the waters of the sea. Also I dare someone to explain how food just magically appears out of the sand in the middle of desert area. If god could just make food for people who deserve it, how come millions of children starve to death, when children are suppose to be the most innocent of all God's creations. Nothing makes sense in any religion except Buddhism, which if any religion I was going to believe in it be that. But like I said, I don't believe in any religion but my own collection of ideas.
For this blog though I'll describe what I think if when I hear the word hell, as I am doing for my descriptive paper. Hell is a vast pit filled to the brim with fire and unmeasurable gallons of molten magma. Everything consists of either a deep shade of red or charred crusty blackness. Bodies writhe in the fiery waters of this pit with looks of the utmost pain searing across their figures. These bodies are not those of the human world, but the charred remains of individuals that have succumbed to the third degree burns all the way down to the once gleaming white, but now is blackened and brittle, bone. Chains hang from the absolute, "advanced" as Spongebob puts it, darkness that encompasses what would should be the sky. Instead of smokey clouds you'd expect from the constant burning pit this blackness above is riddled with demonic images of gruesome deaths and looming scowls of the infamous ruler of Hell. The fetid smell of innumerable amounts of rotting corpses pervades every square centimeter of unoccupied space disintegrating any organic matter not destroyed by the blazing fires. Its not only a rotten scent that fills the air it kills the taste buds and causes horrific non-stop vomiting. This putrid stench isn't the only vile smell in the thick and greasy air of Hell, it is also infused with the gritty stink of flaming corpses and brimstone. Just the thought of human fat and skin melting into the air could render a living being dead upon the spot. If a person ever experienced these, they would know for sure that they just entered Hell.
Ohhh, but the smells aren't the only thing that torture the inhabitants of Hell. Oh no. Contemplate sticking your head into a raging explosion of flames, igniting your entire being with scorching flames. Well that's ice cold compared to the temperatures that every damned soul is entitled to in hell. The burning never stops making the skin, sinew, and bone become one while still continuing to be melted into one. The heat is a given in this pit of torture and detainment for every unfortunate sinner, but those whose fancy was tickled by atrocities are subject to much worse than the average sinner. Those chains that dangle from the depths of the inky blackness have a specific use. They are hooked through multiple orifices of these horrible beings and then yanked with great ferocity tearing the sinews of the skin to shreds. But the highly polished cold steel of the chains doesn't completely tear the skin off the body, it leaves them dangling limply with their innards exposed to the roaring heat and flames raging right before them. The searing pain is utterly unimaginable, and if this individual was still a member of the living they would have died well before experiencing the tear of the sinew.
As stupid, or genius, as it may sound my belief doesn't come from my parents, a certain church or even my friend. It actually hit me one day while I was laying in bed staring at my ceiling. It all makes logical sense though. How do I know that people existed before I was born into this world? I don't and considering their is no way to go back in time to prove the world was around and people like Caesar and George Washington actually walked the Earth I believe all of this is made up. It's a fake creation to make my life have meaning and to provide me with lessons and experience to live my life by. These fabled events that occurred in the past are suppose to be guidelines to make sure I don't make these mistakes that they did. At first this sounded stupid even to myself, but then the fallacies of religion persisted into my brain and it all seemed to click. I'm was suppose to figure this out, it's all part of this grand stage that has been set for my life.
Now for my belief of what the word Hell brings to mind. That comes from the constant religious zeal of all Christian, Jewish, and Islamic propaganda that is drilled into everyone's head. TV shows depict Hell as this fiery pit where bad people go when they die. The Bible, which is one of the most read pieces of literature, shoves this image down your throat everywhere you look even if your not Christian. Oh, and along with this belief and image of the place you are drummed relentlessly over the head with how to get there. Being bad apparently send you there. I personally would say that under these circumstances everyone in the world is going to Hell and Heaven is quite empty. Just think about it. The Ten Commandments are literally impossible to not break. You find me someone that hasn't broken them and I'll officially convert to form of Christianity. The entire thought of religion is one giant contradiction, considering the pathway to Hell is marked by not repenting for one bad thing you've done in your life. It makes no sense of why a deity would give humans the ability to make decisions if the wrong decision doomed them to an eternity of pain. Why not just make them do the right thing all the time and do away with the whole realm of hell. And just as a side note, if God is this high and mighty figure that created everything why doesn't he just smite Satan and make him vanish, instead of constantly battling with him.
Gehenna is actually the more realistic of the two fabled places of Hell. It would make sense that the writer of the Bible would place the area for souls to rot for all eternity in the garbage dump of the Jesus age, where fires are constantly burning. A place where souls are constrained to reside for a set time period sounds contradictory, considering why would go there be tempted with the ideal of "everlasting life" (ironic a spirit would want everlasting LIFE) only to be tricked for your "everlasting contempt." That place would almost seem like the Divine One himself was laughing at the souls of the damned, which I'm sure the all-loving God would never do. Furthermore, it's overall harder to envision a blank stretch of nothingness where souls are just floating around waiting for their verdict than it would be to think about a disgusting place where all the trash goes to burn in an everlasting inferno.
From the perspective of a heavily devout Christian I'm sure there isn't varying degrees of sin. To them a sin is a sin, regardless of its severity. But I'm sure most people will agree with me sin does vary. How is it by any means fair for a God to punish someone who steals food for starving children, with a blood-thirsty murder on the same plane of justice. Clearly it would be wrong for this to occur even to a deity like God. Most people would possibly saying killing someone would be the ultimate sin, landing them their own special set of chains in Hell's oblivion plains , but for I'd have to say raping someone is the worst thing a person can do. Someone who is slaughtered doesn't have to continue living with the pain of violation, they do not have to sit and suffer everyday the cruel memories left upon the victim. Nor do they have to shirk away from the pleasures of life due to a fear that is now corresponded to that one incident. How can a person ever enjoy that sexual experience with someone they love, when in the back of their mind their horrific experience is playing repeatedly as they similarities between the two experiences are exchanged. No, when a person is killed they no longer suffer anything. Never again are the forced to feel hunger, sadness, pain, remorse. None of that. They just die. You can't compare the two sins when you really sit and think about it. Rape is by far the most horrific and worst sin possible, if sin actually mattered. This, along with the actions of Hitler, Stalin, and any other genocidal monster, is a crime worth the sharpest chains in the most sensitive of spots above Hell's bubbling fire pit.
No, in my eyes it isn't reconcilable to believe that God is all loving, and this massive figure of justice and love. God in my eyes is a puppet master, that cares more about his own entertainment than the souls of his creations. He is devious and ironically devilish for his actions. Why allow people to make bad choices if your only going to punish them? And it's not even the fact he has given people the power to choose their actions, it is the fact that he choose whether their actions were good or bad. He created us, why allow us to be bad if your only going to punish us. The human equivalent would be for a father to say to his child, "Look if you go outside, bad things will happen to you. But for the moment you will be happy and forget all about the bad things in your future. On second thought, go outside. Go ahead its okay." And then once your outside he says, "You horrid little child now you will pay the consequences!" You can't give some one the option throw it in their face, present it with mounds upon mounds of satisfactions, and then punish them for it. Its not logically fair to humans, when it is within the nature that he created to be curious. Are they suppose to all be strong, smart, and determined enough to go against the hand of their creator and break human nature? No, they aren't. If he was the embodiment of love and grace he would not have created a paradox for his subjects to break.
This battle is not over, but this blog is!
In response to Sarah Crane
HAHAHA, that song is hilarious. Trust Stephen Lynch to take a subject like Satan and make it humorous.
In response to Matt C.
That little poem about God creates a very valid point. How can you be a merciful creator who decides the good and the bad, when you allow people to perish by the hoards. Or people to succumb to highly painful diseases and pestilences. Or to allow children to die of starvation, when their is no viable reasoning to it except their parents are sinners. If everyone of his creations are given the same amount of love and attention then two questions arise. One why are children punished for their parents sins, shouldn't they be born with a clean slate? And two, do I really want that same love and affection you graced this starving two year old with AIDS with? Matt your poem presents my sentiments exactly towards God.
Mike N- “It is there to give directions to the lost, and hope to the hopeless, but most importantly, it’s about faith. It’s about believing through the facts and data that there is something bigger than yourself out there.”
I loved the way you said this line because I agree with you completely on your views of religion and God. I’m not very religious either, but I believe God can give a person hope. I respect those who have a firm belief in God an in believing so, they live a good moral life and try to make a future for themselves.
Carlykins
I know your not gonna see this because its 11:30 and all the non procrastinating children are asleep, but I don't care. This judicial system that is suppose to divine between a child and an adult in cases, is faulty and indecisive. Take the case of this young 15 year old boy who performed wrestling moves on his 10 year old sister and killed her. He was tried as an adult. But R.Kelly was fined and sued for peeing on a non restrained and video taped 15 year old girl, and she was treated as being a minor. Now one 15 is making adult decision, but the other 15 is a minor? Where is the logic in that for your judicial system?
Just something I thought would be nice to discuss
Being a Christian and believing the Bible is true, I believe in Hell as well as Heaven. The way I picture Hell, I don’t necessarily think it involves all of our senses, or that it is even physical whatsoever. Instead I think that our suffering would undergo pain in the sense of guilt, sadness, remorse, and loneliness. Nothing from Hell would exactly bring on these emotions either. Looking back on our mistakes, our lives, and ultimately where we could be if we weren’t in Hell (Heaven), would bring on all of our penitence. And that’s another picture I view of Hell. It’s the fact that on Judgment Day, we would be standing in God’s presence, seeing how it would feel to be near God and being within his company, and then being sent straight to Hell. Now that’s a picture of guilt that could last for eternity! Praying that one day I will never have to be there, I have arrived at my beliefs through my church, and my family’s active role in the church. My dad actually helps out a lot with the church, specifically the teen or youth part of it, and I guess that’s what accounts for the constant reminder of consequences that lay ahead of me. I guess you could metaphorically relate the two in the sense that my dad can send me to my room forever, and God could send me to Hell forever. No pressure. But unlike my dad, I believe that God has the ability to look at everyone’s heart before he sends them to Heaven or Hell. It’s hard because I don’t believe that people have bad intentions or bad hearts, because deep down despite all of our opinions and messed up intentions, all that we really desire is to be happy and have the ones we love be happy too. So there it is, happiness in love that we all strive for, but there are a lot of things that God can additionally look at to determine if we should go to Heaven or Hell. It could be whether we were selfish in our attempts at a good life, or in contrast we genuinely wanted to help people and were constantly trying to make other’s lives better. Another fact that I believe to be very true, is how hard you tried at helping other people to get to heaven opposed to Hell. In James Joyce’s depiction of Hell, he divulges onto this idea, “The mouths of the damned are full of blasphemies against God and of hatred for their fellow sufferers and of curses against those souls which were their accomplices in sin…their companions in misery who aided and abetted them in sin, those whose words sowed the first seeds of evil thinking and evil living in their minds, those whose immodest suggestions left them on to sin, those whose eyes tempted and allured them from the path of virtue.” I take this idea very literal, and even try to apply it to my life. I believe that God is watching who helps sinners, (all of us), move towards a ‘path of virtue’ versus people that take part in as well as recruit souls around them to partake in their sinful lives. I’m not exactly sure what a sinful life consists of though. Of course if you lead a life full of stealing, lying, and murdering, I wouldn’t exactly say you were looking out for the welfare of people; so on one hand maybe this could get you into Hell. But of course although it might be a small sin, sins are still sins, so could partying and deceitfulness get you into Hell also? I guess the accumulation of sins, is a risk that we all must take, but like Eric said, a repenting heart displays this knowledge of wrongdoing as well as a sorrow for your sins, and this is an act that can save us from Hell. Believing both the Old and New Testament, Sheol as well as Gehenna appear to be very realistic to me. I believe that back in the Old Testament time period, there very well could have been a place like Gehenna. And in those days, as well as these current days, I believe in a place like Sheol, if not Sheol itself in the idea of everlasting life or everlasting contempt. I wouldn’t necessarily make Hell out to be in levels. It reminds me of the Catholic idea of limbo, and other levels of Heaven, which I also believe to be false. (I might have confused that concept a little.) I would suppose if you were a little bad in your life and made some mistakes, God wouldn’t send you into Hell #1, while he send Hitler to Hell #45. God would hopefully send you to Heaven in light of the mistakes that you have made. But I do suppose that God can treat different lies differently. I don’t picture God pointing you with a stick for each lie you told, and then throwing a rock at you for each thing you stole, but I think that God will let us examine the sins for ourselves. I believe that God will literally put the ‘weight of the world’ on our shoulders, and will make us go over each sin in our head over and over and over, and decide ‘was it worth it?’, ‘what could I have done better?’, and ‘who did I hurt because of this?’ Besides the ideas of the Ten Commandments that automatically come to mind, I believe that the worst possible sin is to aid others in getting to Hell. Whether we do this on purpose or not in our lives, I believe it is important to stray from it in life. My answer to this is somewhat predictable, and that is that I believe that by merely seeing the people we’re surrounded with in Hell will give us so much shame and sorrow, that this could last for an eternity. Eternally looking at the people you’ve ‘tempted and allured from the path of virtue.’ The last question you ask Ms. Bunje is one that I actually try to decipher for myself a lot. It’s true that we make God out to be a forgiving, merciful, and loving being, which He is, but at the same time it’s hard for us to understand how he could send us to Hell. Its understandable to see why God would put Hell on the table as a consequence of our actions, it creates obedience. And out of this idea of obedience to God, I think that this I what makes Him so mad. The fact that people continue to sin even though they could be obtain Heaven, but choose to go the other route regardless of such a gift, and choose Hell. Either way, I simply believe that there are some things we will never know because of one simple factor: We are not God. It’s hard to tell why bad things happen, good people do bad things, and why God created hell. But when it comes down to it, life isn’t up to us, and if it were we would surely mess it up anyway. We will never understand why God has controlled life the way He has, but then again none of us will never fully understand life at all. I have learned, all that you can do is trust in God, that he’ll guide you in staying away from these sins and hopefully save you from going to Hell!
Legends like big foot and goat man were never popular enough to really influence anyone, but religion as a legend benefited people for the greater good because it gives people someone to turn to in time of need when we feel alone and helpless.
-Toni M
I believe that this idea of religion doesn’t hinder its existence but somewhat verifies its existence. The fact that people feel alone, and yearn for a greater good displays the concept in religion that humans are all given the same ‘frame’ of human nature. This framework includes the facts that humans are sinful but search for the good in the world, that without God we will feel alone, and without Him we are helpless. The fact that we feel this way shows that we do need God, and to a point proves not that we need religion, but that we need God. I don’t think that we were put on the world to fend for ourselves and then hope for the best when we die. In feeling the emotions of loneliness and helplessness, that come natural, it shows us that we do need someone and do need to lead better lives because this was the framework we were endowed with. It’s kind of a confusing concept, but once you get the idea of it, it’s hard to go against it.
By the way Bunje sorry i'm commenting so late! I came home from my soccer game and fell asleep =( sorry im a bummmm<3
To Sergei:
Well, I kinda don't mean that Hell is in our minds, I'm saying that we create our own hell on earth and our mind just kinda keeps us there, you know? If we think that it is, it will be, right? ^_^' I don't know... I'm a bit tired right now...
JORDAN
"Also I dare someone to explain how food just magically appears out of the sand in the middle of desert area. If god could just make food for people who deserve it, how come millions of children starve to death, when children are suppose to be the most innocent of all God's creations. "
->what an inshightful comment. There is so much suffering, starvation, and poverty in the world, and no one can fix it all. If God is so almighty, many ask why he can't mend the situations? However, I know that when people reference God and destiny, they feel that everything happens for a reason. Still, why are certain people chosen to starve, be murdered, or victims of abuse over others? Million dollar Question.
Oh and I just saw your other comment Jordan. Exactly what I'm saying too. The judicial system is a joke. What made me think of it is the book I'm reading about Jodi Piccoult called Perfect Match, in which a laywer works to help abused children receive justice, however they rarely ever win the case because they are declared "immature" or have said to make up fake scenerios.
Anyway, Jordan you may have thought I was supporting our courts but I was just being sarcastic. :P
Post a Comment